PSA: Driver+ Almost Caused a Crash

[Pfleegz]

Last week I was driving on the interstate using Driver +. Out of nowhere the vehicle lurched hard left towards the guardrail of a bridge. Luckily I was able to react quickly and save the vehicle from a crash.

With my two kids in the backseat it was a terrifying experience. I have lost all confidence in Driver+. There was nothing in the road, no merging cars, on a well marked and lined interstate and a relatively straight portion.

I’ve been in contact with service and they advised to not use Driver + on my vehicle for the time being. They pulled the data surrounding the time it happened to learn more.

Please let this serve as your PSA. Make sure you’re fully attentive with Driver+.

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[Marchin_MTB]

Thanks. I am not comfortable even trying Driver+ given how unpredictable the ACC has been. Maybe if there are no other cars around and there is no one else in the truck with me, I would give it a try.

 

[Pfleegz]

Thanks. I am not comfortable even trying Driver+ given how unpredictable the ACC has been. Maybe if there are no other cars around and there is no one else in the truck with me, I would give it a try.

It had worked brilliantly for me prior to this incident. But as they say, only takes once. A scary situation for sure.

 

[SteveInBend]

I tried Driver+ for about 30 seconds last week on I-84 east of Portland. We were in the left-most lane with a guardrail to the left. The truck was either bouncing between the lane markings or staying too far to the right near a semi to be comfortable for me.

I also turned off LKA on two-lane roads because it felt smoother when I was in complete control.

 

[Sypher077]

You’re far from alone. This happened to me a lot and I reported it a lot. They even requested I take into service and all they said was “couldn’t replicate the problem.”

I found that, for me anyways, it is the really bright contrast between shadows from bridges, etc and the main sun lit road. Like LKA thinks the shadow is the road and tries to lunge towards the median which makes no sense for a “mapped” road.

 

[bd5400]

Please let this serve as your PSA. Make sure you’re fully attentive with Driver+.

People need to be fully attentive regardless of whether they have had an issue with Highway Assist. It is not a system, nor is it meant to be a system, where you don’t have to be attentive.

Tesla’s autopilot has created a lot of false confidence in these systems, despite the fact that people have died in serious accidents while using autopilot.

 

[Ape Latex]

I had the same experience as OP. The car jerked left towards the center divider. I had to fight it to bring it back into my lane. It kept fighting me and pushed me into the lane on the right. I wrestled it back into my lane and it gave control back to me. I haven’t been brave enough to try it again.

 

[Atlrivian]

Unfortunately, I've seen several threads on this. Always in the left-most lane. I don't use Driver+ for this reason, as well as: weaving back and forth within a lane, constantly alerting me to take control of the wheel for one reason or another (tunnel detected, no lane line detected, etc.), staying insanely far back from the car in front of me, and randomly not being available.

I tried randomly a week ago to use it both ways on the 8 mile highway portion of my commute through Atlanta on 75/85. This is a major interstate. Was only available for ~40% of my way into work and ~25% of the way home.

 

[kizamybute']

Yep, I've stopped using it if I'm in the far left lane and there is no shoulder.

We have to remember, we are in the infancy of self driving assist features. They can and WILL make bad mistakes at any given unexpected moment. Need to ALWAYS keep your hands on the wheel to be able to take over, not "if" it makes such a mistake, but "when" it makes such a mistake. And that means actually gripping the wheel, not just resting your hand on it.

Of the most popular driver assist systems available today, Rivian does appear to be the furthest behind. So much so that I find myself using it less and less. Constantly having to disengage for what it calls upcoming "tunnels" or to change lanes, etc. Seems like more work driving with it on than it is just driving without the system. Maybe ok for some wide open, relatively straight roads in low traffic situations. But, any type of complex driving is beyond its capability at this time.

Tesla has been dedicated to developing auto pilot for many years now with a huge team of people tackling it, and they still have a long ways to go. Just shows how hard it is to develop such a system. Rivian has bigger fish to fry right now and have indicated that they only have a small group of people working on improving it right now. So it will be a while before Rivian's system is on par with other systems. Once they deal with their bigger things, such as ramping up delivery, then maybe they'll put more effort into this system.

 

[Tahoe Man]

Last week I was driving on the interstate using Driver +. Out of nowhere the vehicle lurched hard left towards the guardrail of a bridge. Luckily I was able to react quickly and save the vehicle from a crash.

With my two kids in the backseat it was a terrifying experience. I have lost all confidence in Driver+. There was nothing in the road, no merging cars, on a well marked and lined interstate and a relatively straight portion.

I’ve been in contact with service and they advised to not use Driver + on my vehicle for the time being. They pulled the data surrounding the time it happened to learn more.

Please let this serve as your PSA. Make sure you’re fully attentive with Driver+.

Don't blame you for losing confidence.
I've never use self driving on any cars I've owned. It doesn't put me at ease, just makes me more nervous.
Not sure why anyone would trust some computer with the self driving thing, there's already enough nuts on the roads. Frankly, I think many use it so they can play on their phone... But that's just my opinion.

 

[Yellow Buddy]

Yep, I've stopped using it if I'm in the far left lane and there is no shoulder.

We have to remember, we are in the infancy of self driving assist features. They can and WILL make bad mistakes at any given unexpected moment. Need to ALWAYS keep your hands on the wheel to be able to take over, not "if" it makes such a mistake, but "when" it makes such a mistake. And that means actually gripping the wheel, not just resting your hand on it.

Of the most popular driver assist systems available today, Rivian does appear to be the furthest behind. So much so that I find myself using it less and less. Constantly having to disengage for what it calls upcoming "tunnels" or to change lanes, etc. Seems like more work driving with it on than it is just driving without the system. Maybe ok for some wide open, relatively straight roads in low traffic situations. But, any type of complex driving is beyond its capability at this time.

Tesla has been dedicated to developing auto pilot for many years now with a huge team of people tackling it, and they still have a long ways to go. Just shows how hard it is to develop such a system. Rivian has bigger fish to fry right now and have indicated that they only have a small group of people working on improving it right now. So it will be a while before Rivian's system is on par with other systems. Once they deal with their bigger things, such as ramping up delivery, then maybe they'll put more effort into this system.

I'm not sure if it varies from vehicle to vehicle or if there is learning behavior. I know even in Tesla's, two different vehicles on the same software could act differently.

That said, my Rivian ping pongs between the lines. It's reminds me of what Nissan was capable of...in 2007. Tesla's autopilot in 2016 as far as I can remember is better than where Rivian is today.

I use it, I don't trust it. But I use it in hopes that the data - disconnects, forced corrections, etc. will help speed up the development. Then caution is of course always pay attention and be in position to take over. The same goes for Tesla. Even in the current year I've had mine pull randomly, slam on the brakes randomly, or disconnect without so much as a warning.

 

[SeaGeo]

Last week I was driving on the interstate using Driver +. Out of nowhere the vehicle lurched hard left towards the guardrail of a bridge. Luckily I was able to react quickly and save the vehicle from a crash.

This has been reported a couple of times now. I also had a similar thing happen, and thankfully I was very quick to react and react calmly. It would be very easy for someone to freak out and over react to the car.

 

[DB-EV]

This has been reported a couple of times now. I also had a similar thing happen, and thankfully I was very quick to react and react calmly. It would be very easy for someone to freak out and over react to the car.

Rookie question here: Is there plain old cruise control (without driver assist) in the R1' s?

 

[SeaGeo]

Rookie question here: Is there plain old cruise control (without driver assist) in the R1' s?

No. It's a feature request I've made before.

ACC don't steer you into a wall, but it can phantom brake at times.

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