From Lightning Lariat ER to R1S Gen 2 large pack

[hammick]

Hey guys. I'm new hear. We are a two EV household with a Lightning ER and an Ioniq 5 Limited AWD. We use the Lightning to travel between our two homes in Kansas City and Red Lodge, Montana. Road tripping in the lightning with the terrible charging infrastructure across I-90 in South Dakota and Wyoming is getting old. We test drove a Gen 2 R1S and loved it. However, I just realized they downsized the battery from Gen 1 and I can really find any good info on range, efficiency, etc. Can't go back to ICE or diesel as I hate driving either after four years of driving EVs.

Do you guys think Kyle with out of spec will get Gen 2 vehicles for testing or did he burn his bridges with Rivian when he did the Gen 1 R1T large vs max range test and subsequent podcast? We are going to keep the lightning as it's value is terrible. Our Ioniq has 11 months left on a single pay lease and wanting to replace it with an R1S. However, I'll be sick to my stomach if we shell out 85k (or 7k more if we have to get max pack) for an R1S and it doesn't improve our road trip experience much over the Lightning. The plan is to lease the R1S to get the tax credit and then buy it out either immediately or when bank account interest rates are no loner paying 5%.

I really like to understand why Rivian chose to make the batteries smaller. I'm not seeing from owners that efficient has been greatly improved.

Thanks for any advice.

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[beatle]

Kyle already tested the R1S standard dual motor and got 241 miles (270 rated) @ 2.6mi/kwh. If the large follows suit and gets 85% of its rated range, you're looking at around 285 miles. I think the Lightning ER gets around 270-280 @ 70mph according to Tom at State of Charge. The Rivian won't have access to any more charging stations than the Ford, so I'd expect your road tripping experience to be about the same, charging wise. If you don't already have a NACS adapter, I'd get one, then plan your trips on ABRP with the adapter checked and see how it changes your route. It'll make charging more consistent, at least.

 

[mcarver316]

If cutting down on charging is your goal from point A to point B, then a Silverado EV is probably your best bet- 400+ miles of real world range at 70mph with its 200+ kWh battery and up to 300 kWh charge rate.

Also, maybe just waiting what 2025-2026 brings might be better for you. For example, Dodge Ram Charger with E-Rev sounds like a good alternative for road trippers with very big bladders that hate to stop for charging.

 

[hammick]

Kyle already tested the R1S standard dual motor and got 241 miles (270 rated) @ 2.6mi/kwh. If the large follows suit and gets 85% of its rated range, you're looking at around 285 miles. I think the Lightning ER gets around 270-280 @ 70mph according to Tom at State of Charge. The Rivian won't have access to any more charging stations than the Ford, so I'd expect your road tripping experience to be about the same, charging wise. If you don't already have a NACS adapter, I'd get one, then plan your trips on ABRP with the adapter checked and see how it changes your route. It'll make charging more consistent, at least.

We rarely get above 2.0 mi/kwh in the ford at 70mph unless we have good tail wind. I think the R1S has a much better charging curve at lest up to 50%

 

[beatle]

I'm curious how much time you're actually saving in charging time and what that's worth to you. I certainly don't think you're going to be that far ahead with the Rivian. Plan a couple of routes with ABRP using a Lightning ER and a gen2 Rivian and see how much longer it'll take in the Lightning. There are plenty of reasons why a Rivian is nicer than a Lightning (former Lightning ER owner here) but charging/range isn't a significant one. If I wanted an ideal road trip vehicle with zero charging hassles, I would have just kept my Model S.

 

[hammick]

If cutting down on charging is your goal from point A to point B, then a Silverado EV is probably your best bet- 400+ miles of real world range at 70mph with its 200+ kWh battery and up to 300 kWh charge rate.

Also, maybe just waiting what 2025-2026 brings might be better for you. For example, Dodge Ram Charger with E-Rev sounds like a good alternative for road trippers with very big bladders that hate to stop for charging.

Thanks but this will also be my wife's daily driver and we certainly don't need two full size trucks. I was shocked she actually liked the R1T and would probably be fine with that. it would require removing some cabinets in her garage bay though.

 

[SANZC02]

We rarely get above 2.0 mi/kwh in the ford at 70mph unless we have good tail wind. I think the R1S has a much better charging curve at lest up to 50%

I have a gen1 quad R1S on 22s, I just drove through Montana and South Dakota going east and was getting a little better than 2.3 miles per kWh in conserve on those highways doing 70-75.

I think the new duals will do better than that because the rear motor will automatically disconnect.

 

[SeaGeo]

I think scaling up by 85% of EPA is a relatively safe bet for going 70mph. Maybe a bit more. With mixed highway use and *a lot* of tight turns accel/regen and a little bit of rain I just averaged 2.5 mi/kwh in our Gen2 max pack on 20" ATs over a long day trip, which would equate to 360 miles of range with Rivian saying it has 370 miles of range.

Personally I'd get the max pack at the moment with their 3% financing deal. The lease rates are just not good.

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If you want an SUV with the absolute longest range and fastest road trip experience, wait for a Lucid Gravity.

 

[Scoiatael]

Hey guys. I'm new hear. We are a two EV household with a Lightning ER and an Ioniq 5 Limited AWD. We use the Lightning to travel between our two homes in Kansas City and Red Lodge, Montana. Road tripping in the lightning with the terrible charging infrastructure across I-90 in South Dakota and Wyoming is getting old. We test drove a Gen 2 R1S and loved it. However, I just realized they downsized the battery from Gen 1 and I can really find any good info on range, efficiency, etc. Can't go back to ICE or diesel as I hate driving either after four years of driving EVs.

Do you guys think Kyle with out of spec will get Gen 2 vehicles for testing or did he burn his bridges with Rivian when he did the Gen 1 R1T large vs max range test and subsequent podcast? We are going to keep the lightning as it's value is terrible. Our Ioniq has 11 months left on a single pay lease and wanting to replace it with an R1S. However, I'll be sick to my stomach if we shell out 85k (or 7k more if we have to get max pack) for an R1S and it doesn't improve our road trip experience much over the Lightning. The plan is to lease the R1S to get the tax credit and then buy it out either immediately or when bank account interest rates are no loner paying 5%.

I really like to understand why Rivian chose to make the batteries smaller. I'm not seeing from owners that efficient has been greatly improved.

Thanks for any advice.

Gen 2 R1S Large pack and Lightning ER are probably going to have a very similar range. The only advantage Rivian might have is a slightly better charging curve and access to Rivian chargers (if there are any near you).

Lucid Gravity might be an option(not sure how much that is going to cost), and KIA EV9 is also an options (cheaper cost, even for GT version, and faster charging, but no Tesla supercharger access).

 

[mcarver316]

Thanks but this will also be my wife's daily driver and we certainly don't need two full size trucks. I was shocked she actually liked the R1T and would probably be fine with that. it would require removing some cabinets in her garage bay though.

Ok you want an SUV- The comparison to the lariat threw me off

Gen 2 R1S Large pack and Lightning ER are probably going to have a very similar range. The only advantage Rivian might have is a slightly better charging curve and access to Rivian chargers (if there are any near you).

Lucid Gravity might be an option(not sure how much that is going to cost), and KIA EV9 is also an options (cheaper cost, even for GT version, and faster charging, but no Tesla supercharger access).

The KIA EV9 sounds like another viable option- fast charging 800v architecture, decent range, reasonable pricing. I just saw one in person last Saturday and the build quality is impressive. The Gravity is also nice if its within the OP’s budget.

 

[Electrified Outdoors]

All EV values have tanked unfortunately. I would argue it's not just EVs though.

Here are approximate usable capacities:

Gen1 Large: 131 kwh

Gen2 Large: 110 kwh (large + is a software nurfedax pack)

Gen2 Max: 142 kwh (same as Gen1 max).

Rivian made a smart move with the pack sizes. Large was too close to max on Gen 1 making it not such a good value to go with max. Now there is a considerable difference in both range and usable capacity.

 

[mcarver316]

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All EV values have tanked unfortunately. I would argue it's not just EVs though.

Here are approximate usable capacities:

Gen1 Large: 131 kwh

Gen2 Large: 110 kwh (large + is a software nurfedax pack)

Gen2 Max: 142 kwh (same as Gen1 max).

Rivian made a smart move with the pack sizes. Large was too close to max on Gen 1 making it not such a good value to go with max. Now there is a considerable difference in both range and usable capacity.

There’s no way to sugarcoat this- Rivian is fighting fiercely for its survival, hence anyway it can make money is likely the reason for reducing the gen 2 large capacity against the max pack, rather than making the 180 kWh they considered. Then, there is also space constraints and weight increase the additional modules would result in a much heavier truck, possibly tipping 8000 lbs, with current battery technology.

 

[hammick]

Ok you want an SUV- The comparison to the lariat threw me off

The KIA EV9 sounds like another viable option- fast charging 800v architecture, decent range, reasonable pricing. I just saw one in person last Saturday and the build quality is impressive. The Gravity is also nice if its within the OP’s budget.

We looked at an EV9 GT-Line Saturday. Didn't drive it as dealer had it roasting in the sun at 5% SOC and it had been that way for months probably. We thought the interior was very cheap looking. The Tucson looked like a Mercedes inside compared to the EV9. It was the brown interior which we don't like so will check out the light interior at some point. Hopefully they don't do the same with the Ioniq 9 when it comes out. We had high hopes for the EV9.

 

[amcg3]

If you want the most range for road trips max pack is the way to go. If you buy them, they are are offering 2.9% , not sure about their lease deals.
Roadtrips will be better once you have a Tesla adapter and hopefully the charging infrastructure gets better.

 

[blacknight]

If cutting down on charging is your goal from point A to point B, then a Silverado EV is probably your best bet- 400+ miles of real world range at 70mph with its 200+ kWh battery and up to 300 kWh charge rate.

Also, maybe just waiting what 2025-2026 brings might be better for you. For example, Dodge Ram Charger with E-Rev sounds like a good alternative for road trippers with very big bladders that hate to stop for charging.

Biggest downside with Ram is it's still owned by Stellantis. The Ram Rev-Charger is also not very efficient by comparison, as it has a 27-gallon tank for the gas generator and the battery pack is 92 kWh (141 miles) and gets an advertised total mileage of 690 miles. Assuming you want to take the 85% approach for the battery range, that puts real world at 120 miles (1.304 miles/kWh) plus ~550 (20.370 mpg) from the gas generator.
The Ram REV is about the same: 168kWh for a range of 350 miles, or 229 kWh for 500 miles. Using the same 85% rule, you get 1.771 miles/kWh and 1.856 miles/kWh respectively.

If range is your thing, then yes, it's a good option, but I feel most people looking for an EV want more than just range.
Also, didn't get me wrong, I've been a huge fan of Ram since I was a kid and spent time riding around with my Grandpa in his '85 Dodge Ram, and I was very excited when I first saw Ram's concept, but (for me anyway so that's a caveat I know) efficiency and range were very big factors when researching the various EV pickups coming out.

Anyway, just wanted to give my friendly 2 cents =)

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