RJ on CarPlay (Autoblog Post / Stratechery Interview)

[thrill]

Yes, I've been forced to adapt. I'm still going to complain/suggest features I want.

Name checks out.

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[captainjp]

Do you call the local TV station to argue with the weatherman because the weather forecast hurts your feelings? Do you accuse them of defending and making excuses for the planet's atmosphere?

“Yes”

 

[Supratachophobia]

Again, never once got behind the wheel of the Model S in over a decade and thought, "geez, wish I had Android auto"......

 

[captainjp]

He and Wasym can keep repeating these lies, but lots of us aren't buying the bullshit. He sounds like our political "leaders" these days. Alternative facts.

lol. Alternative facts.

 

[Eeyore]

Talking about playing music you already paid for, what about playing music via USB drive. Such a simple application! A terabyte USB drive with hundreds of albums of my favorite music will provide high quality playback with or without cell signals especially when off roading which is Rivian meant to do — off grid, off cel tower!

Just like I could on my 2009 Civic? That would be ideal.

 

[Just Passing By]

I don't need ACP or AA, provided Rivian can access my own lossless music and also access offroad mapping solutions like onX Offroad or similar, either with native apps or using cell phone hosted apps. If Rivian cannot do this in the R2 then I would consider this a miss on their part at this stage. Especially in an Adventure Vehicle that may be out of cell range on occasion, even just driving through the mountains, not even off road. I have no intention of subscribing to music streaming services, so that's not an option.

Rivian not supporting ACP and AA is fine by me but that surely should be driving a higher priority to natively provide services that are otherwise unavailable in the absence of those interfaces. Having to stick a cell phone up on the dash somewhere to gain such access is so last decade.

 

[COdogman]

He and Wasym can keep repeating these lies, but lots of us aren't buying the bullshit. He sounds like our political "leaders" these days. Alternative facts.

 

[Newtonrj]

Somehow re-stating the fact Rivian will not, and have made it quite clear, and will never include native support for CarPlay is "defending Rivian"? There is little to no value in having discussions about ACP in Rivians to begin with. This infantile "my way or no way" logic makes it completely worthless to have any dialog.

If you don't want to see people "defend" Rivian, then why are you even here at rivianforums.com? to expose yourself to the very thing you don't want? Leave.

What is yet again interesting is I’m not arguing FOR CP but rather what Rivian did deliver, Apple Music. Because it is so lackluster, it keeps CP discussions going. If Rivian really delivered Apple Music integration; no 1-2 min lag loading Favorites, limited playlists, non/syncing with playlists that were updated days ago, then there would be little enthusiasm for CP, but they haven’t. So, CP, something Rivian doesn’t support & is less than acceptable still looks better than the Rivian version where they own the whole stack.

 

[skyguyscott]

I understand RJ's wanting complete control of the stack, he, like Steve Jobs was, is a control freak. It's true that Jobs wanted to retain complete and utter control of the iPhone app environment, but to his credit and Apple's immense benefit, he changed his mind and allowed third-party developers in (albeit with constraints and caveats). Jobs retained tight control of the MacOS, preventing users from customizing their desktops to the degree that MS Windows permitted. Like if you had FLWright design your house, you had to put up with him also designing your furniture, the interior design, colors and arrangements, and in some cases, the wardrobe of your wife! -- the cost of hiring an architectural genius.

I think Rivian would do well to swallow its considerable pride and explore working with Apple as a partner. It's not like their software guys don't already have enough on their plate with Autonomy+ and surpassing FSD v14.

Rivian can't afford to lose potential customers and collaboration and cooperation may yield unexpected benefits, greater market share and long term success.

 

[Conseil]

Used to think CarPlay was a must have in any of my vehicles. Not anymore. RJ is right on track.

 

[therealcmj]

Used to think CarPlay was a must have in any of my vehicles. Not anymore. RJ is right on track.

for every person that says this there’s someone that thought “I can live without CarPlay” and then regretted it.

 

[venomcoupe]

If the Rivian software did not suck people would not ask for CarPlay. But since it does suck people do ask for CarPlay. I had the EV sport line system switched over to EV play and it just makes it so much better. Could I live without it sure but do I want to….. no. But if the Rivian software was up to snuff then it would not be as necessary. 20 years ago we had nothing and we were happy with it but once you get something you don’t want to move backwards. The fact is the Rivian software is not up to snuff for the dollar value of the vehicle. Lucid was the exact same way Tesla is much better at it cause they’ve been doing it so long.

 

[KBabione]

Used to think CarPlay was a must have in any of my vehicles. Not anymore. RJ is right on track.

You made the time to learn about the Rivian and bought it knowing it didn't have CarPlay (as we did). How many more Rivians would have been sold by now to people who would have bought one if CarPlay had been an option? Thousands? Having CP in your vehicle doesn't force you to use it - it simply gives you the option.

 

[theonetruestripes]

Every time I drive a car with CarPlay it feels cheap and bland.

It feels bland because (almost) every car has it, not because it lacks any visual style or presentation.

You don’t like it, and that is fine.

RJ thinks Rivian is better off without it, and he runs the company. It isn’t likely his views will change (although Steve Jobs was opposed to bringing iPod to Windows users, and apps to the iPhone, SJ was a bit uncommon in that he could change his mind about big choices, I’m not expecting RJ to do so).

I think RJ is wrong. I don’t own a large share of an automotive company, nor am I CEO of one. So my opinion isn’t very important here.

Still I’ll point out CarPlay has a lot of nice things Rivian hasn’t managed to get around to doing. One of my talking points on this has gone away, so I want to acknolage none of these are destined to stay unimplmted forever. CarPlay’s maps give human centric directions, like “left at next stop sign”. Until Rivian adopted Google maps it did not (“left in 300 feet”....gosh is that at the stop sign, or is that the little road before the stop sign?).

Other things Rivian’s infotainment center hasn’t caught up with. Having dedicated podcast players. Having spoken word (like podcasts or audiobooks) pause for directions not just get ducked (I find it hard to understand either thing that is getting said when that happens). Having the podcase resume at the last word or sentence boundary not in the middle of the word (note: not actually a CarPlay features, that is a feature of the particular podcast player I use, which would operate w/ Rivian via bluetooth except Rivian chooses to duck the podcast sound channel not pause it).

The perennial favorite “text messages”, although CarPlay covers more than just SMS.

I do agree with RJ, if you don’t take control of the experience you can’t offer a better one. I’m not sure if my conflict is thinking Rivian’s isn’t good enough, or if it is thinking that offering carPlay as well isn’t going to cause a substantial number of people to “just use CarPlay” and never experience the “better” that Rivian has to offer it (assuming one thinks it is better -- and it certainly is at EV routing).

Rivian’s is definitely much better then GM ever had, and improving more quickly then I experienced Tesla’s do. I’m not arguing this is a fatal mistake, just a mistake. Like say “not offering the yellow color anymore”, and like the color mistake it is also something Rivian could fix quite quickly if they change their mind on it.

Meanwhile I’ll enjoy my expanded hands free areas and CarKey (plus AC charging “improvements” that really are rather later then they should be).

...as an aside my wife just recently got an older VW Golf, one of the few joys it has for me is CarPlay. I men sure, it accelerates like a tractor, it can’t clear more then maybe 3 inches of snow (i.e. it is a 9 month car here in Vermont), the seats are heated, but the steering wheel is NOT, and you can’t set a temperature so you can make it “not too cold”, but a few minutes later it is “way too hot”. I guess I also get a little kick of nostalgia (long ago I had a VW based on the Golf platform).

 

[mkhuffman]

On a side note, my Mach-e had the best AA implementation I have ever heard of in a vehicle. Running Google Maps was amazing because it was tied into the car's SoC and efficiency, predicting exactly the level of charge at destination. That is one of the features I miss the most.

That said, Rivian has done a excellent job integrating Google Maps and I expect it will keep improving.

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