EVs Mooch Off, Do Not Pay Fair Share for Road Usage

[riv-e-in]

The caveat is that not ALL states and municipalities charge higher fees... yet. The fact is that our increased weight causes more damage, so we should be required to more than the average ICE vehicle. We should all be charged an annual fee based on weight and miles driven.

Adding to the conversation…

ESAL’s (equivalent single axle loads) are how roads are designed, and how heavy vehicles drive road design.

Also including websites that discuss ev registrations & taxes & vehicle weights; every state is different.

https://sizepedia.org/how-much-does-a-ups-truck-weigh/

https://worldpopulationreview.com/state-rankings/most-popular-car-by-state

https://www.atlasevhub.com/data_story/ev-drivers-in-36-states-pay-a-surplus-of-fees-each-year/

https://taxfoundation.org/data/all/state/electric-vehicles-ev-taxes-state/

https://www.thepennyhoarder.com/tax...hat-may-come-with-having-an-electric-vehicle/

https://pavementinteractive.org/reference-desk/design/design-parameters/equivalent-single-axle-load/

Sponsored

 

[Zoidz]

I still maintain that EV’s should not be paying such a high registration tax “because we don’t pay the gas tax”

gas tax and taxes I pay on my electrons from the grid are taxes. Not our fault the government doesn’t use the taxes to where the money “should go”.

EV’s are then taxed again with a large registration fee. $1260 this year for my R1T in Cali for a renewal vs $250 for my ICE minivan.

That $1000 from registration and taxes on my electrons are by far and away more than our “fair share” for the negligible amount of more damage we do to roads. And is much more than an ICE would pay with registration and gas tax.

Well, you live in California, so…

But seriously, if EVs are paying more road use tax than ICE vehicle equivalent, that’s discriminatory and should be challenged. In Pennsylvania, the upcoming EV tax was based ICE equivalent tax. As I recall, they took the average fuel tax an average ICE would pay for 12,000 miles a year and set that as the EV tax.

 

[Zoidz]

Bottom line is the average EV weighs more than the average ICE and, therefore, causes more damage.

It’s a bit more complicated than that. My father was a civil engineer and owned a paving company. As a teen summer job, I helped lay thousands of tons of asphalt. Later on I wrote a pavement defect tracking/analysis program for him that logged defect data to determine when maintenance or reconstruction was needed on public roads. I learned a lot from that.

A major portion of wear and tear takes place at signaled intersections. You have probably seen things called pushing, shoving and rutting where there are distortions of the road in the wheel path at intersections. It is seen on major roads, not often on secondary and residential. That is caused by braking and acceleration which on most ICE vehicles, especially trucks, is caused by up to 80% of the braking energy on the front wheels, and 100% of acceleration energy of the rear wheels. As forces are transferred to the front during braking, it’s a lot more force than just axle weight. As we all know, front brakes wear out faster than rear for this reason.

Specific to AWD EVs and regen braking, those forces will be less and are more distributed over a longer distance, compared to a 2WD ICE of equivalent or even greater weight.

 

[Yossarian]

Well, you live in California, so…

But seriously, if EVs are paying more road use tax than ICE vehicle equivalent, that’s discriminatory and should be challenged. In Pennsylvania, the upcoming EV tax was based ICE equivalent tax. As I recall, they took the average fuel tax an average ICE would pay for 12,000 miles a year and set that as the EV tax.

The original EV registration tax proposed was $380, then was reduced to $290. The Legislature eventually settled on $200 for the first year (2025) rising to $250 in 2026 and passed that into law this summer.

You're correct that the fee is supposed to mirror what folks driving ICE vehicles pay in gas tax, or at least that what the Commonwealth says:
The yearly fee equates to roughly what the state Department of Transportation estimates owners of gas-powered vehicles pay each year in the state’s gas tax at its current rate of 61 cents per gallon, among the nation’s highest. Revenue from the gas tax goes into the Motor License fund to pay for highway infrastructure projects and support state police operations.

I'm OK with tax, even at the 2026 level of $250; we EV drivers really should pay our fair share for road upkeep. It would be nice if the tax stayed at $250 for a few years, but I strongly suspect that EV owners in the Commonwealth will see regular increases in their registration fees. Speculation of course, but it's a fee, not a tax, that effects relatively few drivers in the Commonwealth, and at the same time is a regular and predictable source of revenue. This makes raising the EV registration fee almost irresistible to revenue-hungry PA legislators since the blow-back would be minimal, and at the same time they can defend their position and say with a straight face that they did not vote for a tax increase.

 

[Supratachophobia]

Again, I acknowledge that commercial traffic is the largest source of degradation. And though we aren't the largest contributor, it's a false statement to say we don't cause any or that we don't cause more damage than non-commercial ICE traffic.

But it's also a false argument to say that because we weigh 8k lbs and tractor trailer weighs 80k lbs that we do 10% of the damage. It's going to be way less than that.

Even dividing out by axle, we are going to be 4k lbs and a semi will be 16k lbs. Again, semi is exponential over passenger car.

 

[Supratachophobia]

Kill the gas tax and tax people for road maintenance. End of story.

We have too many complicated ways to do simple things.

Fairness would be a per mile tax with a gvwr multiplier. I currently come out "ahead" on Ohio's $200 per year fee since that calc gets you about 15k miles per year at 30mpg. I'm going 25k+ so I'll just stay conveniently silent personally. But what bothers me, and something I would lobby for, is a lower fee for hybrids (currently $150 in Ohio). They get double-dipped since they also pay the gas tax.

 

[godfodder0901]

But it's also a false argument to say that because we weigh 8k lbs and tractor trailer weighs 80k lbs that we do 10% of the damage. It's going to be way less than that.

Even dividing out by axle, we are going to be 4k lbs and a semi will be 16k lbs. Again, semi is exponential over passenger car.

Correct. That's why I never made that claim.

 

[Donald Stanfield]

Fairness would be a per mile tax with a gvwr multiplier. I currently come out "ahead" on Ohio's $200 per year fee since that calc gets you about 15k miles per year at 30mpg. I'm going 25k+ so I'll just stay conveniently silent personally. But what bothers me, and something I would lobby for, is a lower fee for hybrids (currently $150 in Ohio). They get double-dipped since they also pay the gas tax.

One major problem with per mile, who will track it and how? Are you giving the government access to your mileage and location data now? I could see this being an unconstitutional privacy violation.

 

[godfodder0901]

One major problem with per mile, who will track it and how? Are you giving the government access to your mileage and location data now? I could see this being an unconstitutional privacy violation.

I feel like this would be a self-reporting with random audit type of a thing. Otherwise there would have to be standardization across all manufacturers and the government...

 

[SRO]

Same in NY, we get hit with delivery & system charges that ramp with increased usage. We're all going to be switched to Time-of-Day (TOD) Rates at some point. In the meantime they give you the illusion of choice with all their convoluted rate programs.

NY Delivery & System Charges
The cost to deliver electricity: includes operation and maintenance of
the electric system and certain transition charges of $0.020031/kWh on
behalf of the Utility Debt Securitization Authority, the owner of such
transition charges.

Misc taxes/Fees
DER Charge $ .004675
Delivery Service Adjustment 0.59
Revenue Decoupling Adjustment 0.04
NY State Assessment 0.40
Revenue-Based PILOTS 2.63

Our gas taxes go directly to the DOT and county roads. I can’t believe it goes to the general fund in other states.

 

[SRO]

I feel like this would be a self-reporting with random audit type of a thing. Otherwise there would have to be standardization across all manufacturers and the government...

In our state we report our odometer reading every time we register or renew the registration of our vehicles. This is a fairly recent change.

 

[Zoidz]

Our gas taxes go directly to the DOT and county roads. I can’t believe it goes to the general fund in other states.

Pennsylvania Turnpike Tolls, intended for road maintenance, have been diverted to fund the State Police for 50 years. BIllions of dollars over the years.

 

[SRO]

Pennsylvania Turnpike Tolls, intended for road maintenance, have been diverted to fund the State Police for 50 years. BIllions of dollars over the years.

That sucks.

 

[docwhiz]

The caveat is that not ALL states and municipalities charge higher fees... yet. The fact is that our increased weight causes more damage, so we should be required to more than the average ICE vehicle. We should all be charged an annual fee based on weight and miles driven.

We shouldn't ignore the subsidies that fossil fuel receives. These should be eliminated to "even the playing field".

 

[Tlohrenz]

Texas charges $400 for EV road use tax which I think is high.

Sponsored