WTF Utah?

[SpikeyMikey]

Yup, got the 30a adapter...it's come in handy a few times . And btw, I learned a few years ago when researching how to charge an EV from a battery like the Zendure or Jackery that you need a special grounding plug inserted into one of the AC 15a outlets, or it won't work. Here's the one I got, and it's worked well the few times I've used it.

Will definitely check in with the rangers at Hans Flat a few days before our trip to ask about conditions on Poison Springs Wash Rd--thanks for the advice on that, @JeremyP!

I estimate that the 5kwh from the batteries will yield 10-12 miles of range, possibly less in that environment. But I can probably do that twice, maybe even three times, using solar. So that ain't nothin', and who knows, it might even be the difference if conditions are even more challenging than I expect. 18 days away...

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[SpikeyMikey]

Actually, the old Tesla-only charger is still Tesla-only, and it always will be (it's a V2 charger).

But there's a new Tesla V4 charger that just opened across the river. That one is open to Rivians.

Oh sweet--I see the separate one on Plugshare now that is open to non-Tesla EVs. Thanks for the heads-up, @VSG!

 

[SpikeyMikey]

comfort, esp in an area where towing can get quite expensive and time-consuming. And that was on dry surfaces.


I can confirm that a 2023 R1T 135kwh would cut it too close for comfort on range going from Hanksville at 95% SOC to Doll House, via the shortest route (Poison Spring Rd). And I'm comfortable taking risks on range...have had many close calls in my 13-yr EV driving experience spanning 7 different EVs, but have never once run out of charge.

We were doing great on range until about 15 miles from Doll House--192 off-road miles remaining. Then after 4 miles of very challenging terrain, we dropped to 176. I estimate we would have arrived in the low 150s had we continued, slightly better than half. But any issue at all that might require more battery usage (wet slickrock/mud, helping recover someone else stuck, etc) would have put us negative.

So we pulled over onto a rock about 3 miles past Teapot Rock and camped. We charged the truck using the 5kwh of portable battery we brought, giving us about 8 miles of off-road range, as expected. I forgot to turn off most power after putting it in Camp Mode, however, so inadvertently burned about 6 of those 8 miles in vampire drain (doh!).

With 178, we headed back in the a.m., and even using the long way to Hite and then back to Green River felt we could have made it with buffer to spare, esp with a top-up at Dukes in Hanksville while grabbing lunch.

However, when traversing some of the most challenging sections, a tie rod snapped, and we were done. Eight hrs later the tow truck arrived from Moab, and spent the first 3 hrs manually manipulating (kicking, shoving, hitting with a sledge hammer) the tire to turn in the direction needed as we crept ever so slowly toward Teapot Rock. Then, just before reaching the tow truck (which could only make it as close as about 400 yds away), the other tie rod snapped. 24 hrs later, am almost back to SLC on the tow truck (stopped in Moab for 8 hrs to sleep, and to seek out repair options there, to no avail).

Apparently, wimpy tie rods are a known issue with R1s until 2024. It never occurred to me to look into that, as I'd assumed they must be pretty beefy for an Adventire Vehicle. The tow-truck guy said he's never seen such pathetically skinny ones on a truck, let alone a 7200-lb one. Seems Rivian upgraded them for 2024+ models, but never advised 2023- owners like me to buy an upgrade or a set of reinforcing sleeves. After $7K of towing costs, a 19-hr towing ordeal, and a $200 hotel room, am pretty pissed about that. Oh, and of course Rivian won't replace the tie rods under warranty, so that's another few hundred bucks I'll have to eat.

I have no problem accepting responsibility for the consequences of my own off-road decisions, but sheesh, not even a heads-up for us "adventure vehicle" enthusiasts, or even a "so sorry dude...let us at least cover part of the towing to SLC, and maybe comp you a set of upgraded tie rods, bc Rivian should accept responsibility for its own design/component shortcomings." Am actually a bit surprised the tie rods didn't snap sooner, as I've done a fair amount of off-roading in the 30 mos I've owned it.

We took a bunch of vids as well...will piece them together and post on YouTube as soon as we can make time to do so (hopefully in the next week).

 

[SpikeyMikey]

(apologies for the random text at the beginning...thought I had deleted that before posting)

 

[BigSkies]

In somewhat positive news, I participated in Tesla's "vote for new Superchargers" process.

The most recent round had a proposed spot in Hanksville. It is ranked 26th out of 500 in voting for North America. So I give that pretty good odds.

 

[JeremyP]

Oh man, that's so crummy about the tie rods. I wanted to reach out about tagging along but I was taking the kids to do a 14'er this past weekend. Don't hesitate to reach out (or anyone else for that matter) if you have an issue and have cell service. I'm just a few hours from there and would do what I could to help.

 

[SpikeyMikey]

Oh man, that's so crummy about the tie rods. I wanted to reach out about tagging along but I was taking the kids to do a 14'er this past weekend. Don't hesitate to reach out (or anyone else for that matter) if you have an issue and have cell service. I'm just a few hours from there and would do what I could to help.

Thanks man...will do!

 

[SpikeyMikey]

In somewhat positive news, I participated in Tesla's "vote for new Superchargers" process.

The most recent round had a proposed spot in Hanksville. It is ranked 26th out of 500 in voting for North America. So I give that pretty good odds.

When I was at Duke's RV Park in Hanksville last Fri eve, the manager there said that just a week or two ago, a team of Rivian employees were there inspecting things and asking a bunch of question about things related to electric/charging. Hope that means that Rivian will be installing a RAN site, perhaps in addition to a Tesla/NACS one.

 

[SpikeyMikey]

comfort, esp in an area where towing can get quite expensive and time-consuming. And that was on dry surfaces.


I can confirm that a 2023 R1T 135kwh would cut it too close for comfort on range going from Hanksville at 95% SOC to Doll House, via the shortest route (Poison Spring Rd). And I'm comfortable taking risks on range...have had many close calls in my 13-yr EV driving experience spanning 7 different EVs, but have never once run out of charge.

We were doing great on range until about 15 miles from Doll House--192 off-road miles remaining. Then after 4 miles of very challenging terrain, we dropped to 176. I estimate we would have arrived in the low 150s had we continued, slightly better than half. But any issue at all that might require more battery usage (wet slickrock/mud, helping recover someone else stuck, etc) would have put us negative.

So we pulled over onto a rock about 3 miles past Teapot Rock and camped. We charged the truck using the 5kwh of portable battery we brought, giving us about 8 miles of off-road range, as expected. I forgot to turn off most power after putting it in Camp Mode, however, so inadvertently burned about 6 of those 8 miles in vampire drain (doh!).

With 178, we headed back in the a.m., and even using the long way to Hite and then back to Green River felt we could have made it with buffer to spare, esp with a top-up at Dukes in Hanksville while grabbing lunch.

However, when traversing some of the most challenging sections, a tie rod snapped, and we were done. Eight hrs later the tow truck arrived from Moab, and spent the first 3 hrs manually manipulating (kicking, shoving, hitting with a sledge hammer) the tire to turn in the direction needed as we crept ever so slowly toward Teapot Rock. Then, just before reaching the tow truck (which could only make it as close as about 400 yds away), the other tie rod snapped. 24 hrs later, am almost back to SLC on the tow truck (stopped in Moab for 8 hrs to sleep, and to seek out repair options there, to no avail).

Apparently, wimpy tie rods are a known issue with R1s until 2024. It never occurred to me to look into that, as I'd assumed they must be pretty beefy for an Adventire Vehicle. The tow-truck guy said he's never seen such pathetically skinny ones on a truck, let alone a 7200-lb one. Seems Rivian upgraded them for 2024+ models, but never advised 2023- owners like me to buy an upgrade or a set of reinforcing sleeves. After $7K of towing costs, a 19-hr towing ordeal, and a $200 hotel room, am pretty pissed about that. Oh, and of course Rivian won't replace the tie rods under warranty, so that's another few hundred bucks I'll have to eat.

I have no problem accepting responsibility for the consequences of my own off-road decisions, but sheesh, not even a heads-up for us "adventure vehicle" enthusiasts, or even a "so sorry dude...let us at least cover part of the towing to SLC, and maybe comp you a set of upgraded tie rods, bc Rivian should accept responsibility for its own design/component shortcomings." Am actually a bit surprised the tie rods didn't snap sooner, as I've done a fair amount of off-roading in the 30 mos I've owned it.

We took a bunch of vids as well...will piece them together and post on YouTube as soon as we can make time to do so (hopefully in the next week).

Update
__________________________

It wasn't "another few hundred bucks" I have to eat, but over $3,000(!!!!). And that's just to replace the crappy tie rods with a new set of crappy tie rods (along with a couple add'l fixes that I don't fully understand yet), bc Rivian said the 2024+ tie rods are incompatible with 2023 and earlier models. This blows my mind, as the difference is just 2mm (though the difference in strength is apparently over 30%). I was so sorely tempted to just tell them to pound sand, have the vehicle towed back to my house, and train myself how to replace tie rods w/better ones...but alas, I make more $$ doing what I do (am self-employed), so the math tells me it's smarter to just pay 'em, get my truck back, and then figure out how to make my $70K+ off-road adventure vehicle capable of doing actual off-road adventures...aaaaaaargh!

So, the tow out of the Maze District to Moab was almost $7K, the repair over $3K, and with the unexpected hotel and related costs the total is almost $11K. And that's not counting the value of our lost time, of course...which as I age (am 57) seems the most valuable thing of all.

I'm so incredibly disappointed in Rivian.

I begin the search for replacement tie rods, reinforcing tie-rod sleeves, etc...

 

[JeremyP]

SpikeyMikey, did you happen to put your videos together of the trip?

 

[SpikeyMikey]

SpikeyMikey, did you happen to put your videos together of the trip?

Not yet, @JeremyP , as all clips are on my son's phone. Will ask him to upload somewhere for me so I can edit in the coming days.

 

[Erik+]

Update
__________________________

It wasn't "another few hundred bucks" I have to eat, but over $3,000(!!!!). And that's just to replace the crappy tie rods with a new set of crappy tie rods (along with a couple add'l fixes that I don't fully understand yet), bc Rivian said the 2024+ tie rods are incompatible with 2023 and earlier models. This blows my mind, as the difference is just 2mm (though the difference in strength is apparently over 30%). I was so sorely tempted to just tell them to pound sand, have the vehicle towed back to my house, and train myself how to replace tie rods w/better ones...but alas, I make more $$ doing what I do (am self-employed), so the math tells me it's smarter to just pay 'em, get my truck back, and then figure out how to make my $70K+ off-road adventure vehicle capable of doing actual off-road adventures...aaaaaaargh!

So, the tow out of the Maze District to Moab was almost $7K, the repair over $3K, and with the unexpected hotel and related costs the total is almost $11K. And that's not counting the value of our lost time, of course...which as I age (am 57) seems the most valuable thing of all.

I'm so incredibly disappointed in Rivian.

I begin the search for replacement tie rods, reinforcing tie-rod sleeves, etc...

A few hundred bucks or so and you could be carrying spare rods with you and replace them on the trail. They are not very difficult to swap out, and a skill worth learning if you do serious off-roading. A pair of aftermarket sleeves probably would have saved you too. Definitely would not be blaming Rivian for having to pay out of pocket for a situation they did not put you in, but that's just my opinion, and we all know how those go. Hope it gets fixed right and you get back out there and don't let this experience deter you.

 

[SpikeyMikey]

A few hundred bucks or so and you could be carrying spare rods with you and replace them on the trail. They are not very difficult to swap out, and a skill worth learning if you do serious off-roading. A pair of aftermarket sleeves probably would have saved you too. Definitely would not be blaming Rivian for having to pay out of pocket for a situation they did not put you in, but that's just my opinion, and we all know how those go. Hope it gets fixed right and you get back out there and don't let this experience deter you.

Yes, all things I have learned as a result of this experience, @Erik+ ! The DHD tie-rod sleeves seem to be what others here have recommended, and I've spent some time watching multiple Youtube videos on swapping out tie rods, adding sleeves, and the like. And no, I'm not letting this experience dampen my off-road enthusiasm, am just a bit more grizzled and wiser now

And I do think Rivian played a part in the situation I put myself in, as their whole brand is about "adventure." I had presumed (incorrectly) that this means the vehicles they sell are designed robustly enough to handle such adventure, and clearly this is not the case when it comes to their tie rods (and possibly other crucial components, one wonders?).

Had they advised owners like me--those of us who had never had a vehicle designed to go off road until becoming a Rivian owner--that the OEM tie rods are really only for on-road adventures, I could have made an informed choice ahead of time, vs the experience I had. At a minimum, when they decided to upgrade their tie rods for 2024+ models, a courtesy notification to the rest of us would have been the customer-centric thing to do, along with recommended options.

On a related note, the Moab-based towing guys said their fastest-growing source of revenue is Rivian owners with broken tie rods. So yeah, not a great indicator for an Adventure Vehicle company...

 

[mitchman]

Utah has some awesome adventure areas…and charging should NOT be one of them. I love the awesome National Parks, but hate their EV charging options. CA, OR, WA, AZ, CO are all 100x better.

 

[SpikeyMikey]

Not yet, @JeremyP , as all clips are on my son's phone. Will ask him to upload somewhere for me so I can edit in the coming days.

OK, finally got the raw clips from my son and made time to stitch them together. Not as informative or complete as I had envisioned, but hopefully still useful to many of you!

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