2027 BMW i3 EV revealed with 440 miles range

[ATLRivvy]

iX3 looks awesomenand great tech, but I'm not sure I see it yet as a direct competitor to R2. iX3 pricing begins where R2 ends. Sure, there will be some overlapping cross-shoppers, but I feel it will be a small fraction of buyers.

BMWs are priced for aggressive leasing and frankly the depreciation math so far shows leasing as a good financial decision for mass-market EVs right now.

They will be competitive

Sponsored

 

[BCondrey]

They don't seem too impressed over in the BMW forum... Lots of discussion about "kidneys", whatever that is.

 

[richguess]

Get that charge port moved to driver‘s rear for use of Tesla Superchargers.

 

[TexasBob]

Get that charge port moved to driver‘s rear for use of Tesla Superchargers.

It needs to be curbside for European street charging. Tesla Superchargers are no big deal. The black v4 cabinets solve the problem (even on v3 sites) and until Tesla gets its act together you can always take two spots like you do with R1.

No one needs to move their charge port to the drivers rear.

 

[richguess]

I have a 2024 q8 Etron, and even using 2 slots it can be very difficult to get the charger cord to its port. For my run from SoCal to NoCal (425 miles) there are very few V4’s available. I don’t care about European curb charging. The R2 and the Volvo ex60 both are driver’s rear side ports, and all things being equal (which, of course, they never are) I would go with them. I’ve owned a lot of BMW’s and I bet this one will drive and handle better than these other 2, so when everything is out, I plan to drive all 3 and then decide. I bought my Etron as a lease return, so I’m not so seriously invested.

 

[UnsungZero_OldTimeAdMan]

I have a 2024 q8 Etron, and even using 2 slots it can be very difficult to get the charger cord to its port. For my run from SoCal to NoCal (425 miles) there are very few V4’s available. I don’t care about European curb charging. The R2 and the Volvo ex60 both are driver’s rear side ports, and all things being equal (which, of course, they never are) I would go with them. I’ve owned a lot of BMW’s and I bet this one will drive and handle better than these other 2, so when everything is out, I plan to drive all 3 and then decide. I bought my Etron as a lease return, so I’m not so seriously invested.

Tesla’s charge port location is “right” only because Supercharger is the one network in the US with most coast to coast coverage. And most Superchargers were planned and built accordingly, without foresight of supporting other brands with different port locations. And ports locations are all over the place in the car industry due to lack of standardization and collaboration. If you asked each OEM, they’d say theirs is right because of their platform packaging/engineering needs. Right/wrong is subjective.

And Tesla’s port is where it is due to layout of a particular rented mansion Elon called home. Engineers wanted driver front because it’s most common for people to park nose-in. He overruled them because of his singular unique needs. So there is no one absolute “right”. It’s just how things transpired and the circumstances they produced. Updating sites to longer cables would make it a nonissue; save for a few outliers.

 

[TexasBob]

I have a 2024 q8 Etron, and even using 2 slots it can be very difficult to get the charger cord to its port. For my run from SoCal to NoCal (425 miles) there are very few V4’s available. I don’t care about European curb charging. The R2 and the Volvo ex60 both are driver’s rear side ports, and all things being equal (which, of course, they never are) I would go with them. I’ve owned a lot of BMW’s and I bet this one will drive and handle better than these other 2, so when everything is out, I plan to drive all 3 and then decide. I bought my Etron as a lease return, so I’m not so seriously invested.

I hear you. Never had a problem with the R1 at a Tesla station but fundamentally this is Tesla's problem to solve. Since the US is a piddling little EV market compared to Europe, I understand why BMW prioritized the European roadside convenient location. Rivian did the same thing with the R2 until they were harangued into changing it to accommodate the Tesla network.

Anyway none of that has any impact from my perspective. If you buy a BMW you are going to avoid the old Tesla v3 stations as much as possible anyway because they are too slow. The 250 miles in 10 minutes (or something close) can be had at a 400kw Ionnity station not at the slow-poke 400V previous gen Tesla stations. I suspect it will all work itself out.

 

[UnsungZero_OldTimeAdMan]

I hear you. Never had a problem with the R1 at a Tesla station but fundamentally this is Tesla's problem to solve. Since the US is a piddling little EV market compared to Europe, I understand why BMW prioritized the European roadside convenient location. Rivian did the same thing with the R2 until they were harangued into changing it to accommodate the Tesla network.

Anyway none of that has any impact from my perspective. If you buy a BMW you are going to avoid the old Tesla v3 stations as much as possible anyway because they are too slow. The 250 miles in 10 minutes (or something close) can be had at a 400kw Ionnity station not at the slow-poke 400V previous gen Tesla stations. I suspect it will all work itself out.

Since Rivian has export plans, it’s possible they engineered the platform for both sides. BMW could have too. We’ve not seen their US-spec cars. And with US trade policy being what it is, it’s looking like all non-American OEMs have pivoted to EU markets being priority, while cutting US market forecasts. Another example of “America first” doing anything but that.

 

[TexasBob]

Since Rivian has export plans, it’s possible they engineered the platform for both sides.

Possible. It was definitely originally in the right rear (passenger) and then Kyle...

 

[richguess]

I agree, hopefully the cords get longer and the other chargers (RAN, EA, Etc.) continue to expand. When the EA chargers are available, they have the 350kw system. Elon hasn’t shown much interest in the charging system, it’s probably too far from Mars.

 

[NY_Rob]

I continue to see people posting about BMW (lack of) reliability, shop rates, etc... while maybe their ICE vehicles are more problematic, my personal experience with my own BMW i3 has proven it to be extremely reliable and 100% trouble free since I purchased it used in 2021. Our i3 had 36K miles on it when we bought it in 2021, it now has 76K miles on it, that's 40,000 trouble free miles so far.

 

[UnsungZero_OldTimeAdMan]

Possible. It was definitely originally in the right rear (passenger) and then Kyle...

Yup. I remember. A lot of noise over nothing. Just like debates over 800V architecture and range. It’s the charging infrastructure that needs advancing more, but almost always neglected.

 

[TexasBob]

Yup. I remember. A lot of noise over nothing. Just like debates over 800V architecture and range. It’s the charging infrastructure that needs advancing more, but almost always neglected.

IMO no debate over the 800V and range... Rivian massively screwed up there. But I know others are fine with it and okay by me. I will go with the Volvo or BMW or Audi next round since Rivian chose the other path.

 

[UnsungZero_OldTimeAdMan]

IMO no debate over the 800V and range... Rivian massively screwed up there. But I know others are fine with it and okay by me. I will go with the Volvo or BMW or Audi next round since Rivian chose the other path.

It doesn't matter how many cars are released with 800V capable of faster charging at faster DCFC rates IF the DCFC sites cannot deliver. Too much focus on the cars and not nearly enough on the infrastructure. It's like going gah-gah over a sports car that could deliver amazing performance if on race fuel, but you can't buy said race fuel everywhere you go.

Plus, R2 is a critical inflection point for Rivian and they absolutely had to nail price targets (and we now see they have done it). The most efficient path to that is to scale, streamline and enhance existing architecture. Had they chosen to chase the 800V trend, it likely would have added cost, time and incurred delays.

I personally like that they aren't chasing fads, but sticking to their plans in a thoughtful and methodical manner.

 

[TexasBob]

It doesn't matter how many cars are released with 800V capable of faster charging at faster DCFC rates IF the DCFC sites cannot deliver. Too much focus on the cars and not nearly enough on the infrastructure. It's like going gah-gah over a sports car that could deliver amazing performance if on race fuel, but you can't buy said race fuel everywhere you go.

Plus, R2 is a critical inflection point for Rivian and they absolutely had to nail price targets (and we now see they have done it). The most efficient path to that is to scale, streamline and enhance existing architecture. Had they chosen to chase the 800V trend, it likely would have added cost, time and incurred delays.

I personally like that they aren't chasing fads, but sticking to their plans in a thoughtful and methodical manner.

I remember people saying the exact same thing in 2017 about why it was pointless to have a 200kw charging on a model 3 vs the 55 kw charging on the Bolt since there was no infrastructure. It is your money and your choice but for me, a vehicle is a multi-year horizon. Gemini tells me there are 10,000 800V ports today (Mostly EA, EVGo, Ionna, Mercedes, and small number of Teslas). By 2028 it tells me there will be 30-35k with the biggest shift coming from the Tesla v4 upgrade. Since I am not even planning to get a new vehicle until next year (when the real R2 starts shipping) I have a strong perspective that the difference is worth it.

I will let you have the last word on this but my 2c is that for us through hard won experience, range and charging matter a lot. (Indeed, range matters even more now that we have put solar in. It gives one the flexibility to wait to charge until the vehicle is naturally parked during the max solar production time rather than a stupid inefficient battery draw.) But different folks, different priorities.

Sponsored