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savethemanual

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More like the other way around. That’s a new Shepard shirt from the Gear Shop based on the vehicle color. First time I’m seeing RJ wearing merch. I approve. 🤣
Yes, someone else already pointed that out. Apparently I need to nose around the gear shop more often 😉
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BrayBay

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"Think ‌of ⁠it as finding a way to structurally ingest the technology," Scaringe said. "The advancements in terms of going from the early lidars that I think a lot of us have seen - we see them here - to these much more advanced solid-state lidars, those advancements didn't happen in the United States. Those advancements happened in China."
This is the most interesting part of the interview to me. Seems to imply that Rivian doesn't have much choice, if they want to have state-of-the-art LIDAR systems it's not going to find it in the US. The supply chain, the skill set, the cost structure, etc... all doesn't exist here.

Kind of makes me think of Apple. Forget all the "Designed in California" branding, there's no other place in the world other than China with the advanced manufacturing to put together all the components/sub-components of an iPhone with precision and at scale.

If RIvian truly wants to control its own stack, to "structurally ingest the technology" for LIDAR, it's going to have to partner with a company in China.

On a lighter note, I do want that jacket now.
 

Billyk24

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Makes me think Lidar in a (customer retail) R2 will not occur in 2026. Software for this item hasn't been or needs to be redone with new hardware? Too many questions. Not willing to purchase/order a Launch edition R2 only to find out mid-2027 it lacks hardware/software to do what has been promised. Wait a few more weeks before canceling my "pre-reservation".
 

Mos Eisley

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Makes me think Lidar in a (customer retail) R2 will not occur in 2026. Software for this item hasn't been or needs to be redone with new hardware? Too many questions. Not willing to purchase/order a Launch edition R2 only to find out mid-2027 it lacks hardware/software to do what has been promised. Wait a few more weeks before canceling my "pre-reservation".
As has been pointed out multiple times in this thread - whatever the Gen 1 of LIDAR will be is already baked in. This new development of fully vertically integrating in house is a play for Gen 2 or maybe Gen 3. The first-year's R2' LE's NEVER promised they'd have the hardware for LIDAR, just the opposite - Rivian has been very clear that they will not be forwards/backwards compatible.
 

DuoRivian

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It makes absolute sense. They are driven to make Rivian’s 100% vertically integrated and they have the backing of Amazon to make this happen through their last-mile fleets. Owning most of your supply chain top to bottom can make you more nimble and efficient. After RJ’s comments about how many manufacturers across three tiers of supply chains (it was more than 50!) just to make the headlight… I can understand why they’d have motivation to own more, more directly.
And while this news doesn’t imply that current timelines for R2 LiDAR might be stretched, I could see it happening. What RJ mentioned here is probably more likely the 2nd or even 3rd gen of lidar.
Agree so all those saying delay until early next year for lidar and RAP1 are going to in 2027 say wait longer for RAP2 and lidar 2.0 - it never ends with upgrades
 

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savethemanual

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Agree so all those saying delay until early next year for lidar and RAP1 are going to in 2027 say wait longer for RAP2 and lidar 2.0 - it never ends with upgrades
For many, cars are just a depreciating asset that get replaced every 3-5 yrs. At some point you just have to jump in with the latest greatest at the time of purchase, knowing the next one will have the latest greatest. On the other hand, there are folks that keep their vehicles for 10+ yrs so I can see the frustration with the ever changing hardware upgrades. At least the software will be constantly upgraded so that helps.
 

CharonPDX

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Yeah, and the superior format was not the one which survived unfortunately.
Eh, Blu-ray eventually added everything HD DVD had, then went beyond it. (I say as someone who still has an HD DVD player and a few movies only on HD DVD, in addition to my 4K Blu-ray player.)
 

NY_Rob

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Eh, Blu-ray eventually added everything HD DVD had, then went beyond it. (I say as someone who still has an HD DVD player and a few movies only on HD DVD, in addition to my 4K Blu-ray player.)
Yes, I was going to add that fact in my post but decided not to. As you mentioned, it took quite some time for BD to solve it's format and physical limitations which HD-DVD had already solved right out of the gate.
 
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savethemanual

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Yes, I was going to add that fact in my post but decided not to. As you mentioned, it took quite some time for BD to solve it's format and physical limitations which HD-DVD had already solved right out of the gate.
Wasn't it because of the deep pockets of Sony, who was backing the Blu-Ray format, why it ultimately prevailed?
 

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NY_Rob

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Wasn't it because of the deep pockets of Sony, who was backing the Blu-Ray format, why it ultimately prevailed?
Yes, it was a while ago.. but that is my recollection as well. Back then Sony was a much larger player in home theater. They had a lot of other big players backing their format as well.
 

Zathras

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This makes no sense. There already are low cost LIDAR chips and making chips is not Rivian's core competency.

It has potential of being rabbit hole and materially impact earnings. This is where RJ need to be s smart make-or-buy executive.....
It makes complete sense. The whole point is to control the whole stack and minimize inputs to the devices that they have no control over. RJ has said he wants to control the whole stack because that's how Apple has done business. And it certainly has worked for them (not including cars, but that I suspect was in part because they partnered too much with legacy car companies rather than try to do it like Rivian). You bring too much foreign hardware into the car and you now are at the mercy of some software writers in India? No thanks.
 

skyguyscott

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Format wars are costly for everyone. In the BR/HDDVD war, consensus is the turning point was when Sony put the higher capacity format in PS 3 consoles. Other factors: the not insubstantial licensing fees, (greed) studio and retail store backing(pressure tactics/bribes), and higher data capacity of BR (ironic because VHS won over Sony's Betamax due to longer initial recording times)

I would argue it's all a loss to consumers because what the Studios wanted all along was to kill the ability of consumers to record and keep content, and watch it without the ability of the studios to monetize it in any way.
 

CharonPDX

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Wasn't it because of the deep pockets of Sony, who was backing the Blu-Ray format, why it ultimately prevailed?
Mostly. There are rumors that Sony basically bribed Netflix and Warner Bros to drop HD DVD. It was those two actions happening within a month of each other that basically doomed HD DVD. (Both had previously supported both HD DVD and Blu-ray.)
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