All Terrain to All-Season Road Tires improves range / efficiency?

[joeblk10]

For what's worth, my original A/T Scorpions 275/65 R20 were done, and I replaced them with Goodyear Wrangler Workhorse HT 275/65 R20. I did not compare efficiency yet, but they are unbelievably quiet! I knew an all season should be quieter than an all terrain, but it was still surprising the lack of any tire noise.

I just replaced with the exact same tire. I was shocked at the difference in road noise. Was expecting to be quieter but not to that extreme. I live in Northern CO and drive to south Denver a few times a week. I've made the drive 3 times now with these tires. With the AT's I would use an average of 55 percent of the battery depending on outside temp for that drive. With these in three drives I'm averaging 53 percent. Now it was a bit warmer with those three drives so at this point I can only guess that its a wash on efficiency going to an good HT vs the EV centric AT. So far extremely pleased with these tires.

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[electruck]

Not to dissuade OP from going with 20s, but the 21s are also Enkei FYI. (I have the 21s and it's literally stamped into the back of them). If you check Enkei's website, ALL of their wheels are cast+forged (they call it MAT). https://enkei.com/engineering/

It's not the manufacturer that makes the 20s superior, it's the fact that (per Rivian) they are forged whereas the 21s and 22s are flow formed (what Enkie has branded M.A.T., Most Advanced Technology). Forged wheels are better suited to surviving off road abuse. Flow formed (a specific casting technique) wheels are great on-road offering a great balance of light weight, strength, low cost, and design flexibility but forged are still superior. The other, hopefully obvious, advantage of the 20s is that they are 20s which means the mass of the barrel is closer to the center (and if the reason why isn't obvious, read up on rotational inertia).

 

[lslick23]

I just replaced with the exact same tire. I was shocked at the difference in road noise. Was expecting to be quieter but not to that extreme. I live in Northern CO and drive to south Denver a few times a week. I've made the drive 3 times now with these tires. With the AT's I would use an average of 55 percent of the battery depending on outside temp for that drive. With these in three drives I'm averaging 53 percent. Now it was a bit warmer with those three drives so at this point I can only guess that its a wash on efficiency going to an good HT vs the EV centric AT. So far extremely pleased with these tires.

You have any pictures with those on your truck?

 

[R1Thor]

It's not the manufacturer that makes the 20s superior, it's the fact that (per Rivian) they are forged whereas the 21s and 22s are flow formed (what Enkei has branded M.A.T., Most Advanced Technology). Forged wheels are better suited to surviving off road abuse. Flow formed (a specific casting technique) wheels are great on-road offering a great balance of light weight, strength, low cost, and design flexibility but forged are still superior. The other, hopefully obvious, advantage of the 20s is that they are 20s which means the mass of the barrel is closer to the center (and if the reason why isn't obvious, read up on rotational inertia).

M.A.T is hybrid cast and forged. It's likely done this way for 2 reasons; ultimately cost. The second reason is ease of transport versus a fully extruded billet that becomes forged later (so...logistically cost).

95%+ of the strength of that wheel comes from the forging process, which changes the grain structure and lengthens the interference boundaries between the anatomical 'layers' of the alloy.

So, while you're sort of correct insofar as a PURELY forged wheel will have slightly increased strength overall, it's honestly, splitting hairs. Depending wholly upon the geometry of the wheel itself, you might net 3-5% better performance from a wheel. But earnestly, these wheels are already over-spec'd for our purposes.

It's like (FDM) 3d printing. Increasing infill seldom gives you much more overall strength, but increasing the walls makes SIGNIFICANT and IMPACTFUL improvements on overall strength of material. In this instance, the entirety of the external most walls of that wheel will be forged and therefore will benefit the absolute most from forging. Spin forging does similar things molecularly.

Also, I appreciate your citing rotational inertia. While I do recommend people read up on it if they're curious, I had enough in Physics 211 in pursuit of my Mechanical Engineering degree, thanks In this instance V = omega * r or rewritten as: V/r = omega and you're correct insofar as that r getting smaller (the radius of the wheel and overall positioning of the mass) will help with the Inertial forces calculated by I = L/ omega, so your net equation will be I = L*r / V, where I is inertia, L is angular momentum, r is radius, and V is your Velocity at any given point on the tire. Your max V is going to be at the very top of your tire as it is moving at 2x the forward velocity of your vehicle. Depending on what your actual varaibles are, I find it helpful to substitute L = I * omega = m*V*r (mass * Angular Velocity * radius) Happy calculating!

 

[electruck]

M.A.T is hybrid cast and forged. It's likely done this way for 2 reasons; ultimately cost. The second reason is ease of transport versus a fully extruded billet that becomes forged later (so...logistically cost).

95%+ of the strength of that wheel comes from the forging process, which changes the grain structure and lengthens the interference boundaries between the anatomical 'layers' of the alloy.

So, while you're sort of correct insofar as a PURELY forged wheel will have slightly increased strength overall, it's honestly, splitting hairs. Depending wholly upon the geometry of the wheel itself, you might net 3-5% better performance from a wheel. But earnestly, these wheels are already over-spec'd for our purposes.

It's like (FDM) 3d printing. Increasing infill seldom gives you much more overall strength, but increasing the walls makes SIGNIFICANT and IMPACTFUL improvements on overall strength of material. In this instance, the entirety of the external most walls of that wheel will be forged and therefore will benefit the absolute most from forging. Spin forging does similar things molecularly.

Also, I appreciate your citing rotational inertia. While I do recommend people read up on it if they're curious, I had enough in Physics 211 in pursuit of my Mechanical Engineering degree, thanks In this instance V = omega * r or rewritten as: V/r = omega and you're correct insofar as that r getting smaller (the radius of the wheel and overall positioning of the mass) will help with the Inertial forces calculated by I = L/ omega, so your net equation will be I = L*r / V, where I is inertia, L is angular momentum, r is radius, and V is your Velocity at any given point on the tire. Your max V is going to be at the very top of your tire as it is moving at 2x the forward velocity of your vehicle. Depending on what your actual varaibles are, I find it helpful to substitute L = I * omega = m*V*r (mass * Angular Velocity * radius) Happy calculating!

Exactly! Flow formed wheels provide most of the benefits of forged at a much lower price point, but forged is still superior - especially in offroad scenarios where strength of the face of the wheel is equally as important as that of the barrel. Enkei makes great wheels, just explaining why "someone from Rivian" would claim the 20" AT wheels to be superior.

for the record: BSAE '94, MSAE '97

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