Future Cost for Rivian Subscription Services

[Rhidan]

Huh. I don’t recall anywhere in my Vehicle Purchase Agreement where Rivian said they could disable existing features in the vehicle i paid for and require me to pay a subscription fee to reactivate those features.

*Shrug*

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[kylealden]

I’m with @kylealden - I suspect and have gotten the impression that the ATT service will be part of the subscription meaning anything on the truck (ie everything) may not work without it. Only possible alternative is if you can tether a cell phone etc to get a data connection for those services, we will see if they allow that

I imagine it will be a bit like Tesla where you still have a live cell service without a subscription and token things like routing and maps will work over LTE, but anything significant (MBs, not KBs) would require a subscription.

 

[Blueassassin]

My guess is the garage door feature will be part of the subscription as well. I'm ok ish with all that as long as the subscription is priced reasonably.

 

[kylealden]

Huh. I don’t recall anywhere in my Vehicle Purchase Agreement where Rivian said they could disable existing features in the vehicle i paid for and require me to pay a subscription fee to reactivate those features.

*Shrug*

You might want to re-read that.

There's likely more and other documents, but these are just a few provisions in the VPA that jumped out at me in a two minute glance.

All that said - Rivian has not suggested they will disable any features. It's reasonable to speculate they may meter or charge for services which require costly bandwidth. That's perfectly reasonable, especially if there is a workaround (e.g. tethering to your phone's hotspot).

There's a weird persistent fantasy in these forums taht Rivian is just going to work/spend day and night to give you value without receiving any ongoing value in return, and that somehow will be smart business.

My guess is the garage door feature will be part of the subscription as well. I'm ok ish with all that as long as the subscription is priced reasonably.

I'd be pretty surprised by that. It's a built-in hardware feature, not tied to any service or new updates.

I really think the decision matrix is going to be:

1. Is it a net-new, major enhancement outside of the expected "continuous improvements" to the vehicle, and which was never marketed as part of the vehicle's standard capabilities (an example would be Tesla's speed unlocks), whose development needs to be offset by revenue
2. Or, does it depend on significant usage of cellular connectivity or other ongoing services (concierges, guides, off-road recovery) at ongoing cost to Rivian that need to be offset by recurring revenue

If yes to either, it's probably either part of the subscription/membership or otherwise a paid feature. If no, I don't see how they take it back without a huge PR upset and potential legal challenges.

 

[mkg3]

The last major discussion on this subject couple of months ago, didn't it end with conclusion that it probably will be around $50/mo or $600/yr? Maybe bit less for paying for annual subscription ahead?

Also there was a discussion of being able to sign up month-to-month as needed.

 

[svet-am]

This is something I have been really curious about as well. I have chatted to some of my friends at Venice Hub and heard that Rivian has all options on the table about what to do but nothing is decided. My favorite was the idea that pre-order holders could been grandfathered and get the subscription free for life but later purchases would have to pay for it. I think that would be a good way to handle it and reward the early investment and loyalty.

 

[astonius]

My guess is the garage door feature will be part of the subscription as well. I'm ok ish with all that as long as the subscription is priced reasonably.

Why would the garage door opener be behind a paywall? It's not a cellular feature or even one that requires ongoing maintenance from Rivian. It's a piece of physical hardware in the truck and a UI element on the screen to control it. Putting that behind a paywall would be nonsensical.

 

[Mcfly Rivian]

This is something I have been really curious about as well. I have chatted to some of my friends at Venice Hub and heard that Rivian has all options on the table about what to do but nothing is decided. My favorite was the idea that pre-order holders could been grandfathered and get the subscription free for life but later purchases would have to pay for it. I think that would be a good way to handle it and reward the early investment and loyalty.

This would be insanely cool. Hoping for this but not holding my breath. I believe Telsa did something similar back in the day for early model s buyers.

 

[Mcfly Rivian]

Why would the garage door opener be behind a paywall? It's not a cellular feature or even one that requires ongoing maintenance from Rivian. It's a piece of physical hardware in the truck and a UI element on the screen to control it. Putting that behind a paywall would be nonsensical.

So is bmw charging to activate your cars seat heaters. I don't think Rivian would do something similar but it's definitely a thing.

 

[Warmoth]

So is bmw charging to activate your cars seat heaters. I don't think Rivian would do something similar but it's definitely a thing.

Unfortunately. BMW Is Now Charging $18 Per Month for Heated Seats in Some Countries (businessinsider.com)

 

[astonius]

So is bmw charging to activate your cars seat heaters. I don't think Rivian would do something similar but it's definitely a thing.

First, that would be for new purchases, not for those who already bought their car with heated seats.

And second, that's so far a pretty isolated case, and BMW is rightfully being dragged over the coals for it. It also doesn't appear to be the case in the US (yet).

 

[DJG]

The last major discussion on this subject couple of months ago, didn't it end with conclusion that it probably will be around $50/mo or $600/yr? Maybe bit less for paying for annual subscription ahead?

Also there was a discussion of being able to sign up month-to-month as needed.

That was based on the projections they included in the IPO, which was an annual potential revenue of $550/year. That is the only available source of information on potential pricing. But it's also subject to change, which would explain why they have still be mulling it over.

 

[DJG]

This is something I have been really curious about as well. I have chatted to some of my friends at Venice Hub and heard that Rivian has all options on the table about what to do but nothing is decided. My favorite was the idea that pre-order holders could been grandfathered and get the subscription free for life but later purchases would have to pay for it. I think that would be a good way to handle it and reward the early investment and loyalty.

How much more charity and good will should Rivian give to early preorder holders?? Give a mouse a cookie.....

 

[Mcfly Rivian]

How much more charity and good will should Rivian give to early preorder holders?? Give a mouse a cookie.....

Maybe good will for the dsp participants who are still holding their shares. ?

 

[DJG]

First, that would be for new purchases, not for those who already bought their car with heated seats.

And second, that's so far a pretty isolated case, and BMW is rightfully being dragged over the coals for it. It also doesn't appear to be the case in the US (yet).

I actually think it's a good idea for everyone, for a number of reasons.

1) it is a huge win for the used market, if every XXX model you evaluate can potentially have the same features with the push of a button. More supply of options that can meet anyone's needs means lower prices for the base vehicle before subscription add ons.

2) Users only pay or what they need/use, instead of what they think they need/use. I have bought many features on cars that I thought I wanted only to learn that I didn't. These include things like air ionizers/scents, massaging seats, etc. I'd rather pay more over time for something I know for certain I value, than wasting money on things I'm not sure of. Also, in it's extreme form, it gets rid of having to pay for a $4k package when all you want in one feature.

3) Users only pay for what they want/need when they want/need it. Only need heated seats/wheel in the winter, only pay for it in winter. Only want massaging seats in road trip season, only pay for it in road trip season.

Like you said, it is not retroactive, so you know the deal going in, and it means the cost of the vehicle is lower. It hasn't been the case lately so much, but ultimately vehicles are depreciating assets, and therefore it doesn't make sense to own everything in them. It's no different than leasing the entire car, which people have done forever, you're just now leasing certain parts of it, but in a way more flexible fashion. The days of "buying" a vehicle and driving it into the ground are numbered (at the individual level, not the vehicle level).

It may be getting pushback now, as people hate change, but eventually the car maker consortium will coordinate and dictate what the deal is and that will be that. It wouldn't even surprise me, especially in an EV world with second life applications of batteries, where people no longer own vehicles at all, and they are all leased/sold as subscriptions. That would actually be much more efficient for the life cycle of energy storage.

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