P2P Self Driving in Gen 2 Vehicles

[rinconryder]

I have a question about what P2P Self driving development looks like for Gen 2 hardware vehicles given that Rivian seems to take a position that LIDAR is necessary for the development of P2P cars and self driving. How can they develop both at the same time? Are Gen 2 cars going to be left behind since they don't have LIDAR? I am guessing they say no but why would they develop for an inferior hardware knowing that they are going to be using LIDAR as part of self driving? Curious what the "experts" out there know about this conundrum.

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[godfodder0901]

LiDAR is only needed do unsupervised. Right now it's used more for data collection, according to Rivian. Gen 2 should be G2G for P2P.

 

[jeffcarp]

Nothing I have seen from Rivian insinuates that lidar is necessary for P2P. I think they've been pretty specific that lidar will not be used until level 4 autonomy. I don't think that they've even insinuated that it's needed for level 3 autonomy.

As I see it, basically by waiting for a car equipped with lidar, you're essentially becoming an additional data input point for you and everyone else in the future. And you're also getting an upgraded processor.

 

[Zevo]

I have a question about what P2P Self driving development looks like for Gen 2 hardware vehicles given that Rivian seems to take a position that LIDAR is necessary for the development of P2P cars and self driving. How can they develop both at the same time?

The same way Apple can develop software for iPhones that do and don't have satellite connectivity at the same time. The ones without it don't get the features that require it.

Are Gen 2 cars going to be left behind since they don't have LIDAR?

Absolutely, without a doubt. The only question is does that happen in 2 years or longer, and how behind will they be left (which may mean some people don't even care). No company will support a tech stack indefinitely.

I am guessing they say no but why would they develop for an inferior hardware knowing that they are going to be using LIDAR as part of self driving?

They absolutely said "yes", but also that it would be a couple of years before anybody noticed the difference. They are developing for the current (not inferior) hardware because that is all they have to sell, and if they don't, nobody will buy it. If they don't continue until at least point to point is delivered, then they will be sued. A lot. So I would expect them to continue to develop for the old (and inferior) hardware for a while after the new hardware (RAP1 and LIDAR) is released.

 

[Ralph]

My understanding is that in addition to helping with certain edge cases (rain, fog, etc.) LiDAR equipped vehicles will help Rivian create maps with more depth precision. Those maps will be used by more recent non-LiDAR Rivians to provide better autonomous driving than if that data were not present in the models.

Apart from LiDAR there is of course the RAP1 chip. I believe Rivian has stated that this chip will be able (read theoretically possible) to deliver level 4 autonomy.

At some point the combination of better maps, facilitated by the LiDAR equipped fleet, real time use of LiDAR, and the power of RAP1 chips almost certainly implies older, less equipped vehicles will have less functionality. "Let behind" will continue to be subjective. What do you want/need?

Personally, even though Rivian says RAP1 and LiDAR will be coming at the same time, I'm thinking that the RAP1 chip is what could make those vehicles more future proof LiDAR. That is if Rivian continues as planned w/their modeling strategy.

A moot point since they will come together but it can be useful to understand what Rivian is currently saying specific tech will bring to the party; even if changes over time (likely).

Don't forget, tech changes at a faster and faster rate. At some point, we as users just have to commit (buy something) just as Rivian has to commit to something years before we see it.

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