Tesla nefarious behavior?

[pamalabama]

This articles talks about some of the claims made about the video

I think the article does fairly because it does point out some weirdness about the video while also debunking claims.

I personally haven't watched it. It's not like I need to watch a video to validate what we already know. We already know the Tesla autopilot (and FSD) constantly misses things. We have enough real world data from practically the start of AP back in 2015 all the way to now. Tesla has the most fatalities of any car brand so DUH!!

https://www.theverge.com/tesla/631308/mark-rober-tesla-youtube-autopilot-lidar-fake-claims

That article avoids the serious claims of the video.

How does autopilot hit a child when activating autopilot while driving across a double solid yellow line? You mean to tell me you can activate autopilot while driving across a double yellow line? I think not.

The point is in many of these tests autopilot was not even engaged.

In the fog test, how do you avoid hitting a child when you cannot see very far through the fog? Exactly like a human does. You slow down well in advance. Something FSD clearly demonstrates an ability to do.

Then the main claim is that FSD would not brake for an "invisible" wall which is also shown to be false by testers in china. The issue is that FSD is not just simple depth estimation and can clearly see that the wall ahead has no parallax.

The point of the video is that you can't drive without lidar in extreme scenarios. And you can. Just like a human does.

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[pamalabama]

Did you come up with proof to support that accusation, or just more bullshit?

It's bullshit because you believe RJ is a saint and would never lie about anything. Rivian is not doing financially well and R2 is their big chance to make it big. It's well known that rivian has one of the worst ADAS systems you can buy and anyone without a good autonomy system is doomed.

So what do you do? You lie at a critical moment while tesla is at their lowest.

 

[Donald Stanfield]

It's bullshit because you believe RJ is a saint and would never lie about anything. Rivian is not doing financially well and R2 is their big chance to make it big. It's well known that rivian has one of the worst ADAS systems you can buy and anyone without a good autonomy system is doomed.

So what do you do? You lie at a critical moment while tesla is at their lowest.

So that's a no then to the proof?

 

[captainjp]

It's bullshit because you believe RJ is a saint and would never lie about anything. Rivian is not doing financially well and R2 is their big chance to make it big. It's well known that rivian has one of the worst ADAS systems you can buy and anyone without a good autonomy system is doomed.

So what do you do? You lie at a critical moment while tesla is at their lowest.

I haven’t heard of anyone being killed while driving with Rivian’s ADAS. Have you?

 

[pamalabama]

I haven’t heard of anyone being killed while driving with Rivian’s ADAS. Have you?

Because rivian's adas system shuts off too often for someone to die. Tesla's adas system stays on for 100s of miles which is why people abuse it

 

[captainjp]

Because rivian's adas system shuts off too often for someone to die. Tesla's adas system stays on for 100s of miles which is why people abuse it

lol. That’s cute

 

[captainjp]

Because rivian's adas system shuts off too often for someone to die. Tesla's adas system stays on for 100s of miles which is why people abuse it

I’d rather it turn off than kill me and my family.

 

[pamalabama]

I’d rather it turn off than kill me and my family.

if anyone's killing their family it is the driver. Misusing a system is no excuse.

 

[andrewgrhogg]

Well.....this is an interesting thread.
1. While discourse on all things EV and on self driving systems is of course warranted, im not sure what poking holes in teslas system is going to achieve on a Rivian forum. Does it move any ball forward?
2. Its obvious there are a lot of people on this forum with serious biases - to be expected, we are all human. But that doesn't excuse just not being willing to look at the data and the "facts", which by the way are not "alternate"
3. Depending on who you believe (and i know some of you believe that tariffs are paid for by the other guy, and that Ukraine invaded russia) its basically known fact that Tesla has in fact disengaged FSD moments before a crash, and that there are active lawsuits about exactly this issue. This really isn't up for debate.
4. We should all take anything we see on YouTube with a grain of salt and an understanding that 99% of the goal is to get eyeballs - and therefore ad dollars. That by need removes a 100% dedication to the "truth" or at least a dedication to telling the whole truth. The video is "staged" but lets not be all crazy and nitpicky and miss the overarching message because we are too focused on the minutia. The message is that FSD is fatally flawed is probably asking for trouble. Your mileage may vary...
5. Rivians FSD equivalent is "years" behind Tesla, but ive been pleasantly surprised with how good they are and how fast they are moving. They've gotten a lot farther than Tesla did in the same time frame. Rivian could have a very workable and useful solution in another year or two for 99% of what people would want to use it for.

Have fun out there people...and keep it classy!

 

[pamalabama]

5. Rivians FSD equivalent is "years" behind Tesla, but ive been pleasantly surprised with how good they are and how fast they are moving. They've gotten a lot farther than Tesla did in the same time frame. Rivian could have a very workable and useful solution in another year or two for 99% of what people would want to use it for.

The premise of the video is wrong because it attempts to show limitations of cameras but "fails" to do so and they have to resort to cheating to make it happen.

There are people in this thread who have gone 50 years without an accident using nothing but their eyeballs

Cameras have no more limitations than your eyeballs and being confused by a "fake" wall is not an issue because you can tell that the wall ahead has no parallax as you are moving close.

Tesla's "camera" limitations are much less significant than people make them out to be. And even with those camera limitations, it's worth mentioning that outside of self driving cars, the lidar you see on most vehicles has quite a narrow FOV

 

[COdogman]

The premise of the video is wrong because it attempts to show limitations of cameras but "fails" to do so and they have to resort to cheating to make it happen.

There are people in this thread who have gone 50 years without an accident using nothing but their eyeballs

Cameras have no more limitations than your eyeballs and being confused by a "fake" wall is not an issue because you can tell that the wall ahead has no parallax as you are moving close.

Tesla's "camera" limitations are much less significant than people make them out to be. And even with those camera limitations, it's worth mentioning that outside of self driving cars, the lidar you see on most vehicles has quite a narrow FOV

“Fails to do so”

 

[pamalabama]

“Fails to do so”

Did you even watch the video? They used autopilot driving over a double solid yellow line. You can't enable autopilot while doing that. They had to fake the result so that the cameras would lose.

Secondly mark rober claims on twitter he did not use FSD because fsd needs a destination in order to work.

FSD does not work like that. You can use it anywhere at any time now. In fact FSD always worked that way. You just turn it on and it drives straight until it hits a dead end and takes a right turn.

Thirdly, people speculate he enabled autopilot at the last moment (before hitting the wall) because he can't get autopilot to hit the wall under normal circumstances. Autopilot from tesla does not contain the occupancy network and the other AI stuff that tesla uses to detect hard to see objects with their latest FSD versions. It is built to run on hardware 2.0 which is really old hardware that older teslas have

 

[COdogman]

Did you even watch the video?

I did. That’s why I’m laughing. Maybe you should watch it a few more times

 

[pamalabama]

I did. That’s why I’m laughing. Maybe you should watch it a few more times

Then use some basic critical thinking. How is autopilot enabled here?

Spoiler alert: It's not




You think FSD would be able to drive in this scenario without seeing a pedestrian in that simple water test?

 

[COdogman]

Then use some basic critical thinking. How is autopilot enabled here?

Spoiler alert: It's not




You think FSD would be able to drive in this scenario without seeing a pedestrian in that simple water test?

The video is real and you have done nothing to prove it’s not. I’m really sorry it’s so hard for you to admit that Tesla has lied to you about the capabilities of their cars.

Maybe they could clear up the confusion and release the raw data they have collected from all those miles? ?

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