Official email from Rivian offering Binding Purchase Agreement

[sevengroove]

Please consult an attorney if you are concerned but the $100 non-refundable deposit is the remedy for breaking the contract. They aren't going to take customers to court to force them to buy a vehicle, would be bad for business.

Not to mention, if we assume prices are trending upward, why would they get in the way of an older pre-order holder backing out of the agreement? It just means they can turn around and sell it to someone at the going rate for more profit (or less loss).

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[mkg3]

.....What I do find disappointing is that our federal legislative bodies do not have enough of a grasp of economic reality to realize that their new EV incentive program will actually hurt EV proliferation....

Actually there is an underlying agenda here. The bill is intended to give advantage to US UNION shops. Rivian, Lucid, Fisker (via Foxconn), Tesla all operate non union factories.

The pricing is focused on vehicles made by F, GM, Chrysler, and foreign makers that have union shops in US (VW, Toyota, Honda, Subaru and so on...). They all make vehicles at much lower price point than the EV only companies.

Also the point of sale rebate under the new bill only applies to dealers, not direct sales. So think back to the original Biden bill, where he wanted more incentives for union made EVs and dealerships that sells union made vehicles. The intent of the original is still embedded in the new bill.

 

[mkg3]

Thanks for clarification. Some folks on the thread are under the impression that this binding cagreement does not help 24 deliveries. Do you think people like me (Explore R1S) that may not have a delivery until 24 are obligating themselves to a purchase with no tax incentive?

I know many members of the forum truly believe that Rivian won'e deliver their vehicle until 2024 but I disagree with that notion.

Rivian has stated many times that they are confident that they can clear the backlog that existed in March by the end of 2023. And if they cannot, they will lose much of those backlog anyway. There are so many ESUVs coming over the next 18~24 months that likelihood of people sticking with Rivian is significantly less - which will move those still on the backlog up.

Today, there is an earning call and in that call, I'm sure that question will be asked about how many BPAs have been signed. This would be a much better indicator of backlog than just a reservation deposit.

 

[Aroohoo]

Actually there is an underlying agenda here. The bill is intended to give advantage to US UNION shops. Rivian, Lucid, Fisker (via Foxconn), Tesla all operate non union factories.

The pricing is focused on vehicles made by F, GM, Chrysler, and foreign makers that have union shops in US (VW, Toyota, Honda, Subaru and so on...). They all make vehicles at much lower price point than the EV only companies.

Also the point of sale rebate under the new bill only applies to dealers, not direct sales. So think back to the original Biden bill, where he wanted more incentives for union made EVs and dealerships that sells union made vehicles. The intent of the original is still embedded in the new bill.

That's is perhaps a valid take based on the "dealer" wording. However, that is just the point of sale rebate, one can still submit at tax time. If it ends up that you can only get the rebate by going through a dealer, then I can see this argument.

As for price point, I'm not sure I follow the logic given the following vehicles qualify under the price limit and have final assembly in the US:

• Cadillac Lyriq (only if it is classified as an SUV)
• Chevrolet Blazer EV
• Chevrolet Bolt
• Chevrolet Bolt EUV
• Chevrolet Silverado EV (with certain options and trim levels)
• Ford F-150 Lightning (with certain options and trim levels)
• Ford Mustang Mach-E
• Nissan Leaf
• Rivian R1S (with certain options and trim levels)
• Rivian R1T (with certain options and trim levels)
• Tesla Cybertruck (with certain options and trim levels)
• Tesla Model 3 (with certain options and trim levels)
• Tesla Model Y (only if it is classified as an SUV, and only with certain options and trim levels)
• Volkswagen ID.4 (only 2023+ models made in Tennessee)

Out of these, it remains to be seen which qualify under battery rule. There is speculation that the Bolt might because its batteries are made in Michigan, but unknown the % content it uses to meet the bill language. Some of the Tesla models may also get a partial credit based on battery assembly but not material content.

I have a slightly different view of why the wording became the way it is that isn't tied to Union plants (unlike the original Build Back Better wording from last year which had explicit Union wording). IMO, the drivers for the current wording are the following (in order of most likely):

1. Limiting total "cost" of the bill.
   • We know that Manchen was big on the budget impact aspect, so having price and income limits that are not tied to inflation keep the cost down. Given the average sale price of EVs (both Truck/SUV and Sedan types), unless there is a major market shift, not a lot of vehicles will qualify in future years
2. Protect traditional oil and gas interests.
   • Although the Dems platform covers environment and climate change, Manchen is on the record as saying he looks out after WV interests which has fossil fuel interests (understand most of this is coal, but I assume most of his constituents aren't big on EVs and EV handouts)
3. Incentivizing Domestic battery production.
   • I am very skeptical on this one. Given the cost of starting up mines, refineries, and factories, I'm not sure that a very limited incentive on the final product will influence business decisions in this area. If they really cared about domestic production, they would have direct incentives to start up these types of operations instead of trying to pass it as a vehicle based incentive that probably isn't going to be worth much due to income and price limits.

 

[Aroohoo]

Has anyone that has yet to get an opportunity to sign the buyer's agreement reach out to CS today?

I was planning on reaching out around 4PM ET (time yesterday when the Tony email went out) if nothing was out by then.

It sounds like those of us that have yet to get anything fall into 1 of 2 camps:

1. Have at least one order that was cancelled and reinstated, OR
2. Have been one of those that have fallen through the cracks that is the Rivian order system (e.g. early order but no delivery estimate, etc)

 

[freshpow]

I know many members of the forum truly believe that Rivian won'e deliver their vehicle until 2024 but I disagree with that notion.

Rivian has stated many times that they are confident that they can clear the backlog that existed in March by the end of 2023. And if they cannot, they will lose much of those backlog anyway. There are so many ESUVs coming over the next 18~24 months that likelihood of people sticking with Rivian is significantly less - which will move those still on the backlog up.

Today, there is an earning call and in that call, I'm sure that question will be asked about how many BPAs have been signed. This would be a much better indicator of backlog than just a reservation deposit.

Hopefully today's earnings call will be insightful, but I don't think the BPAs are any more meaningful than initial deposits. If you're willing to tie up $1,000 for multiple years in the form of a refundable deposit, you'd be silly not to risk (really only a risk if you don't go through with the reservation) $100 to potentially save yourself $7,500.

 

[RBR1S]

Actually there is an underlying agenda here. The bill is intended to give advantage to US UNION shops. Rivian, Lucid, Fisker (via Foxconn), Tesla all operate non union factories.

The pricing is focused on vehicles made by F, GM, Chrysler, and foreign makers that have union shops in US (VW, Toyota, Honda, Subaru and so on...). They all make vehicles at much lower price point than the EV only companies.

Also the point of sale rebate under the new bill only applies to dealers, not direct sales. So think back to the original Biden bill, where he wanted more incentives for union made EVs and dealerships that sells union made vehicles. The intent of the original is still embedded in the new bill.

So wait, what I'm reading this as is - Rivian, Lucid, Fisker = get more lobbyists....

Because what you just said is all of the old, slow, bloated, bailout companies with loads of lobbyists are getting the benefits and the fast, startups aren't getting squat. And the dealers, we've heard their crying non-sense before. They just wanna screw you when you buy a new car and screw any company that doesn't have dealerships.

 

[Batman]

Signed

 

[Speedrye]

It'd be pretty sneaky if Rivian didn't send the BPA out to pre-3/22 order holders that cancelled. Knowing they're the most likely to jump ship with a price increase, Rivian could use this as a chance to rid themselves of those money-losing vehicle orders as many would likely cancel again with what would effectively turn out to be a $7,500 price increase.

 

[Max]

It'd be pretty sneaky if Rivian didn't send the BPA out to pre-3/22 order holders that cancelled. Knowing they're the most likely to jump ship with a price increase, Rivian could use this as a chance to rid themselves of those money-losing vehicle orders as many would likely cancel again with what would effectively turn out to be a $7,500 price increase.

Frankly, I was thinking I had to be mighty desperate to consider F150 but they are getting ready to send another invite to me and and I am considering it, since it is the only reservation I have with any kind of movement. So I may end up being one of those Rivian may want to get rid of.

However I think, quitters (me included) are likely left out because they don’t have that $100 in their reservation to make it legal. Rivian has to setup something for them to pay the $100 that will take more time.

 

[emoore]

Besides Fisker, is any other car company doing this? Ford, Tesla, GM?

 

[Jimi]

I couldn't execute this agreement in any browser, but it did work on my phone, taking me to the Thank You download page!

 

[Friscorays]

Frankly, I was thinking I had to be mighty desperate to consider F150 but they are getting ready to send another invite to me and and I am considering it, since it is the only reservation I have with any kind of movement. So I may end up being one of those Rivian may want to get rid of.

However I think, quitters (me included) are likely left out because they don’t have that $100 in their reservation to make it legal. Rivian has to setup something for them to pay the $100 that will take more time.

Aware of the recent F150 Lightning price bump?

 

[BigSkies]

There is no 12/31/23 deadline.

Apologies, you are correct. I had based my comment on a poorly worded article about 2022 orders delivered in 2023.

 

[midwestchill]

Just got off 2 texts with CS and both had variable replies. First CS rep said that I should wait on the email and that each link is individualized to particular order/customer. The second person said that I should use the link in my wife's account (order placed a few weeks ago so got an email because of the deposit) and that should work as well. So, at this point I don't know what to believe.

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