Rivian Stories: Top Discoveries & news from Rivian factory tour

[Bumble1978]

Can't control quality with that model, unfortunately.

Exactly what did the VP on Manufacturing say....'People, Safety, Quality.' ?

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[skyote]

I’m pretty sure they did the tour a couple of weeks ago but just posted the discussion about it. A lot can happen in a couple of weeks.

Yes, the factory tour was actually Sunday 9/26.

I can't believe nobody here is freaking out about the 11 module Max Pack instead of the previous 12!

 

[EVTrukHog]

Yes, the factory tour was actually Sunday 9/26.

I can't believe nobody here is freaking out about the 11 module Max Pack instead of the previous 12!

it would be comforting to see the Max Pack extended range confirmed BEFORE I spend $10K buying it.

 

[SANZC02]

Yes, the factory tour was actually Sunday 9/26.

I can't believe nobody here is freaking out about the 11 module Max Pack instead of the previous 12!

There was a lot of info in there, hard to say what parts left the most impact.

Thanks to you guys for posting that, enjoyed watching it.

 

[koersontap]

Yes, the factory tour was actually Sunday 9/26.

I can't believe nobody here is freaking out about the 11 module Max Pack instead of the previous 12!

 

[Dbeglor]

I can't believe nobody here is freaking out about the 11 module Max Pack instead of the previous 12!

What does this mean exactly? If I knew perhaps I would freak out

 

[jjwolf120]

I can't believe nobody here is freaking out about the 11 module Max Pack instead of the previous 12!

Actually, I'm not sure if there is anything to freak out about. I forget how many modules the large pack has, but the math works out nicely going from~135kwh with 7 modules to ~185kwh with 11 modules. Each module would have ~16.875kwh.

 

[skyote]

Actually, I'm not sure if there is anything to freak out about. I forget how many modules the large pack has, but the math works out nicely going from~135kwh with 7 modules to ~185kwh with 11 modules. Each module would have ~16.875kwh.

• LE/Large has 9 modules (previously cited as 135 kWh), and the previous Max had 12 modules (cited as 180 kWh), so modules *were 15 kWh each.
• We know the newer Samsung SDI cells have more capacity, so each module should have about 16 kWh each, so Large Pack increased in capacity to 144 kWh, but Max Pack is now 176 kWh.
• At EPA range of 316 for Large, it would be 386 for Max. Unless there's some other magic, it wouldn't hit the magic 400 number they claimed previously...

 

[Toadkillerdog]

• LE/Large has 9 modules (previously cited as 135 kWh), and the previous Max had 12 modules (cited as 180 kWh), so modules *were 15 kWh each.
• We know the newer Samsung SDI cells have more capacity, so each module should have about 16 kWh each, so Large Pack increased in capacity to 144 kWh, but Max Pack is now 176 kWh.
• At EPA range of 316 for Large, it would be 386 for Max. Unless there's some other magic, it wouldn't hit the magic 400 number they claimed previously...

ugh ??

 

[SANZC02]

• LE/Large has 9 modules (previously cited as 135 kWh), and the previous Max had 12 modules (cited as 180 kWh), so modules *were 15 kWh each.
• We know the newer Samsung SDI cells have more capacity, so each module should have about 16 kWh each, so Large Pack increased in capacity to 144 kWh, but Max Pack is now 176 kWh.
• At EPA range of 316 for Large, it would be 386 for Max. Unless there's some other magic, it wouldn't hit the magic 400 number they claimed previously...

Just curious, was that for the R1S and R1T?

I assumed it was referring to the R1S as they were having space issues and said the extended would probably be less than 400. I don't remember where I saw that I thought it was in an interview.

That is bigger news if they mean the R1T as it still has the 400+ in the configurator.

 

[skyote]

Just curious, was that for the R1S and R1T?

I assumed it was referring to the R1S as they were having space issues and said the extended would probably be less than 400. I don't remember where I saw that I thought it was in an interview.

That is bigger news if they mean the R1T as it still has the 400+ in the configurator.

It was a flat statement that battery pack sizes would be 7, 9, & 11 modules. I guess it's still possible that the R1T could use 12, but we shall see...

 

[Dbeglor]

• LE/Large has 9 modules (previously cited as 135 kWh), and the previous Max had 12 modules (cited as 180 kWh), so modules *were 15 kWh each.
• We know the newer Samsung SDI cells have more capacity, so each module should have about 16 kWh each, so Large Pack increased in capacity to 144 kWh, but Max Pack is now 176 kWh.
• At EPA range of 316 for Large, it would be 386 for Max. Unless there's some other magic, it wouldn't hit the magic 400 number they claimed previously...

I think you might be incorrectly assuming that efficiency/range is linear with battery size. Point being, the large pack also has to propel the rest of the vehicle. The marginal battery only has to propel itself, so it should get more range for the weight. In other words, effiency/range should increase when adding batteries if you aren't adding anything else like more vehicle.

Or is that flawed logic? Older Tesla's that published battery sizes should have the data to confirm/deny that thesis. E.g. does a 100D get better efficiency than a 75D, which is presumably the same vehicle except the added batteries.

Plus, this is the first I've heard that Large was as much as 144kwh and it seems to contradict all the EPA data regarding efficiency and range which still pointed to about 135kwh if I'm not mistaken.

 

[skyote]

I think you might be incorrectly assuming that efficiency/range is linear with battery size. Point being, the large pack also has to propel the rest of the vehicle. The marginal battery only has to propel itself, so it should get more range for the weight. In other words, effiency/range should increase when adding batteries if you aren't adding anything else like more vehicle.

Or is that flawed logic? Older Tesla's that published battery sizes should have the data to confirm/deny that thesis. E.g. does a 100D get better efficiency than a 75D, which is presumably the same vehicle except the added batteries.

Plus, this is the first I've heard that Large was as much as 144kwh and it seems to contradict all the EPA data regarding efficiency and range which still pointed to about 135kwh if I'm not mistaken.

Valid question on the overall efficiency. In other EVs, range does appear to be fairly linear with battery capacity, but I understand your thinking. On the flip side, I could see that any portion of battery energy contributes equally to the physics of the given vehicle, and weight plays a much lesser part than aerodynamics. I'd love to have @ajdelange or other engineers weigh in here.

On the EPA testing, I believe that would be usable range (not including some amount of buffer), and maybe @DucRider might be able to answer.

 

[BigE]

• LE/Large has 9 modules (previously cited as 135 kWh), and the previous Max had 12 modules (cited as 180 kWh), so modules *were 15 kWh each.
• We know the newer Samsung SDI cells have more capacity, so each module should have about 16 kWh each, so Large Pack increased in capacity to 144 kWh, but Max Pack is now 176 kWh.
• At EPA range of 316 for Large, it would be 386 for Max. Unless there's some other magic, it wouldn't hit the magic 400 number they claimed previously...

No reason to worry as typical Rivian, they may have told you they went down 1 pack but no other data was provided, so we wait and see. I have given up asking Rivian anything as they provide no answers or some false answers because the CS really doesn't know. I have multiple emails for the past 2 years saying they will follow up when they know and never do. Communication is poor at best.

 

[Dbeglor]

Valid question on the overall efficiency. In other EVs, range does appear to be fairly linear with battery capacity, but I understand your thinking. On the flip side, I could see that any portion of battery energy contributes equally to the physics of the given vehicle, and weight plays a much lesser part than aerodynamics. I'd love to have @ajdelange or other engineers weigh in here.

On the EPA testing, I believe that would be usable range (not including some amount of buffer), and maybe @DucRider might be able to answer.

Now that I actually think about it, that logic wasn't sound, because you're still using a given amount of energy to travel a certain distance, regardless of the total capacity of energy you have at your disposal. And having higher energy capacity means more weight, and thus actually lower efficiency. This is shown by the 75D vs. 100D efficiency, which is higher for the 75D.

So basically, there are diminishing returns to adding batteries, all else equal. Efficiency is zero bound as you add batteries and at some point in theory you wouldn't gain any range by adding more battery.

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