Kim Java’s posing shatters glass pano roof…

[opnwide]

New to this forum. My pano roof cracked on side when I leaned lightly on it to attach Yakhima bike rack. They charged me $2250 and I see they replaced under goodwill for someone who sat on it. Does not feel right...
By the way I got the cracked glass back with me and would be happy to submit it to NHSTA for testing. I also submitted a complaint on NHSTA. A roof glass should be built stronger than that cracks when a 5 year old child walks across it (as an example)


August 11, 2022 NHTSA ID NUMBER: 11478813
Components: VISIBILITY/WIPER
NHTSA ID Number: 11478813
Incident Date July 3, 2022
Consumer Location SAN JOSE, CA
Vehicle Identification Number 7fctgaal5nn****
Summary of Complaint
CRASHNo
FIRENo
INJURIES0
DEATHS0
Roof glass used is a cheap quality product (almost like an acrylic piece). I do not believe it should be on an automotive product. Cracks started developing and growing rapidly all over. Initial point of crack could have been after I installed a bike rack with elbow resting on glass. Was using a ladder for standing next to vehicle. Did not notice the crack immediately but it started on that side and grew rapidly across the surface when parked. I had the glass replaced with out of pocket pay and have the old one with me. I believe there are 2 issues: 1) quality of glass product not meant for rugged use as a roof glass 2) lack of cross beam support for such a long span of glass used in the roof

Wow, sorry to hear of this but thanks for the extra data point. There has got to be someone “up the Rivian chain” you could discuss with the documented discrepancy of others being given a good-will replacement and you being charged that amount. I’m not even convinced that the entirety of Kim Java’s two butt cheeks were on the glass, (I tried watching in slo-mo) but partially on the frame and she leaned back with her hands. Maybe there is something to the Fuyao glass, I don’t know, but reports continue to mount like there is.

Can you share any photos of the broken glass you brought back?

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[orionexp]

New to this forum. My pano roof cracked on side when I leaned lightly on it to attach Yakhima bike rack. They charged me $2250 and I see they replaced under goodwill for someone who sat on it. Does not feel right...
By the way I got the cracked glass back with me and would be happy to submit it to NHSTA for testing. I also submitted a complaint on NHSTA. A roof glass should be built stronger than that cracks when a 5 year old child walks across it (as an example)


August 11, 2022 NHTSA ID NUMBER: 11478813
Components: VISIBILITY/WIPER
NHTSA ID Number: 11478813
Incident Date July 3, 2022
Consumer Location SAN JOSE, CA
Vehicle Identification Number 7fctgaal5nn****
Summary of Complaint
CRASHNo
FIRENo
INJURIES0
DEATHS0
Roof glass used is a cheap quality product (almost like an acrylic piece). I do not believe it should be on an automotive product. Cracks started developing and growing rapidly all over. Initial point of crack could have been after I installed a bike rack with elbow resting on glass. Was using a ladder for standing next to vehicle. Did not notice the crack immediately but it started on that side and grew rapidly across the surface when parked. I had the glass replaced with out of pocket pay and have the old one with me. I believe there are 2 issues: 1) quality of glass product not meant for rugged use as a roof glass 2) lack of cross beam support for such a long span of glass used in the roof

Not feeling great about this issue with Rivian. They need to fix it!

 

[Arky]

Yeah I'm definitely in the camp that a little incidental pressure (someone leaning on it a bit) shouldn't break the thing.

You ever leaned a bit on a windshield or a window? I have, they don't just break.

 

[hugebob]

Aren't vehicle roofs supposed to take into account rollovers? Therefore, being able to support the (partial) weight of the vehicle?

 

[CommodoreAmiga]

Aren't vehicle roofs supposed to take into account rollovers? Therefore, being able to support the (partial) weight of the vehicle?

Not the roof glass panel or sheetmetal, no. The roof structure, yes... The a/b/c pillars and the beam that connects them needs to handle the load. The glass is allowed (and expected) to shatter.

I recall an interview with a Volvo engineer where they discussed how some crushing can be desirable, as that helps absorb energy in a crash. Structures that are too rigid may look stronger (less deformed after a crash) but if too much energy is transferred to the occupants then they may not fare well. Take a look at a F1 car after a crash. It's amazing some of the crashes that those drivers walk away from; but the car is no longer recognizable. The car is sacrificial.

 

[zymolysis]

While slightly flawed, still goes to the point of why do you need to warn people glass cracks when stressed? But fear not, like a coffee being labelled Caution: Contents Hot because people don't expect the hot coffee they order to be hot, there will likely be a disclaimer in the manual soon that will say "Do not rest heavy objects directly on the glass roof."

I want the glass to withstand generalized wear and tear, but a glass roof is just that, a glass roof. If I could option a hard top, I would honestly consider it. And yes, an indestructible "transparent aluminum" roof would be preferred.

" because people don't expect the hot coffee they order to be hot ..."
I don't want or expect my coffee to be scalding hot. Coffee shouldn't cause third degree burns (the jury agreed).
I also don't want my roof to be glass, but if they insist that it must be glass, by God it should be very durable glass.

 

[zymolysis]

Not the roof glass panel or sheetmetal, no. The roof structure, yes... The a/b/c pillars and the beam that connects them needs to handle the load. The glass is allowed (and expected) to shatter.

I recall an interview with a Volvo engineer where they discussed how some crushing can be desirable, as that helps absorb energy in a crash. Structures that are too rigid may look stronger (less deformed after a crash) but if too much energy is transferred to the occupants then they may not fare well. Take a look at a F1 car after a crash. It's amazing some of the crashes that those drivers walk away from; but the car is no longer recognizable. The car is sacrificial.

"The car is sacrificial." Everything but the cockpit/cab is sacrificial. Crumple zones are designed into modern automobiles - but not into the interior of the car, where the occupants are. If a log falls onto the roof (or it rolls over an immovable object), you don't want the roof to crush at all. None.

 

[zymolysis]

As an impartial 3rd party here, neither affiliated with Rivian nor the owner of the vehicle in question... I have no problem blaming the owner.

You can't seriously think the roof is designed to support humans walking or laying on it, can you?

Does Rivian really need a sign stating "Don't walk on the glass roof... It could break."

What's next.... McDonald's needing a disclaimer on their coffee stating it's "hot?" Oh wait... ?

Rivian should not have paid for the repair. This lady was an idiot with her truck and broke it. It was her fault.

"You can't seriously think the roof is designed to support humans walking or laying on it, can you?"
Logical fallacies. You are changing the story. Nobody in this incident did either of those. One fairly small human being sat on the edge, where the glass roof was (at least partially) supported by the metal structure.

 

[ERguy]

"You can't seriously think the roof is designed to support humans walking or laying on it, can you?"
Logical fallacies. You are changing the story. Nobody in this incident did either of those. One fairly small human being sat on the edge, where the glass roof was (at least partially) supported by the metal structure.

That's not a logical fallacy. Anybody who sits on a piece of glass expecting it not to break is an idiot.

You just suggested that she only sat on the edge of the roof, so that shouldn't count. Yeah... You got me. Why didn't I think of that ??

 

[zymolysis]

That's not a logical fallacy. Anybody who sits on a piece of glass expecting it not to break is an idiot.

You just suggested that she only sat on the edge of the roof, so that shouldn't count. Yeah... You got me. Why didn't I think of that ??

Ummm, yes it is. Look up "logical fallacies."
Here, I'll do it for you.
"The Straw Man Fallacy: This fallacy occurs when your opponent over-simplifies or misrepresents your argument (i.e., setting up a "straw man") to make it easier to attack or refute. Instead of fully addressing your actual argument, speakers relying on this fallacy present a superficially similar — but ultimately not equal — version of your real stance, helping them create the illusion of easily defeating you."
When you changed the facts to "... humans walking or laying on (the glass roof)," you created a straw man fallacy, because (apparently) your argument wasn't strong enough when sticking to the facts.

 

[Greg Chick]

Well, it IS a roof not a chair... So while the break does look to indicate a flaw, it is not REALLY meant to be sat on.
And yes, I do thinks thats the worst thing about this. Mistakes are made, designs need to be revised and products leave the factory with imperfections. But a brand new company building a product as complex as a car (and SUV and delivery van) that is looking to blame the customer and dodge responsibility is a HUGE red flag to me.
I was also very early with my model S and they were fantastic about fixing stuff that went wrong. I was a huge advocate for them in the beginning and spread the word about their tech and attitude. But after recent experiences with them I specifically did NOT want a Tesla this time around because of their service. Their tech is certainly beyond Rivian's and I have zero doubts about the survivability of Tesla, but getting service is a nightmare. Don't forget, unlike ICEs there are nearly zero options for repairs except the manufacturer. I had a drive unit fail and it took 3 weeks just to get into service. Then a few more to get the repair done at my cost even though the car had under 35K mi on it. Sure, they gave me some Uber credits, but if I had a schedule like most people, I would have burned through them in less than a week.
Rivian is brand new and still struggling to become a lasting car company. It is far from certain whether they will be the next Tesla or the next Fisker. I hope it's Tesla (without the attitude) but such an early tendency to blame the customer when there are other obvious signs of flaws on their side IS very negative to me.

I noticed a half way crack in my top window, the other day. No sign of rock point damage anywhere. It isn't all the way across the window, but does begon or end at an edge of the glass. I keep my truck in the garage and avoid parking under trees because I hate bird poop. I can't imagine I could have cleaned and used Rain X on it and not noticed the crack, so it happened last week sometime. To me it is a glass problem, but I will need to talk to factory about how many others have cracks without any sign of a rock pitting it.

 

[Greg Chick]

That's not a logical fallacy. Anybody who sits on a piece of glass expecting it not to break is an idiot.

You just suggested that she only sat on the edge of the roof, so that shouldn't count. Yeah... You got me. Why didn't I think of that ??

Mine is cracked half way across and no one sat up there, hell I'm 67 yrs old, I couldn't get up there without hurting myself. I can clean the top glass from the bed of the truck and the front doors open standing on the threashold. I forget if I stood on the gear tunnel doors to clean the top or not, but that is another easy way to clean the top. I can see if someone has a rail rack system on the top and loads something up there thatg it could be dangerous, but the glass is not toughing the truck body top anywhere. How can it get a crack unless someone does sit on it? But who would do that?

 

[s00n]

Didn’t they switch from glass to plastic at some point or am I making that up? If so, did that fix the random cracking?

 

[Supratachophobia]

Don't. Sit. On. The. Glass. Roof.

I always thought that influencers were less smart but now the evidence is empirical.

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