Is Keeping your Old Car Better for the Environment?

[kanundrum]

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[Scott]

That guys channel is pretty awesome. I have watched a ton of his videos, always well put together.

For me personally, my current car is probably better. I just don't drive enough to hit the brake even point for quite some time.

 

[DB-EV]

That guys channel is pretty awesome. I have watched a ton of his videos, always well put together.

For me personally, my current car is probably better. I just don't drive enough to hit the brake even point for quite some time.

Gonna check this out - thanks to the OP for sharing. The analysis I have seen is that for the first 18 mos (for a normal driver, i.e. 18,000 miles), EVs are more polluting due to mfg processes, materials; however, after that point, electric is so much more cleaner that EV's become better for the environment unless you live in a state with really dirty electric (read West Virginia)

 

[ajdelange]

That guys channel is pretty awesome. I have watched a ton of his videos, always well put together.

There is so much bad stuff out there. I've caught this guy in minor mistakes but they are always minor. He is orders of magnitude better than most of the garbage one sees and a breath of fresh air for sure.

 

[ajdelange]

... electric is so much more cleaner that EV's become better for the environment unless you live in a state with really dirty electric (read West Virginia)

Remember that 60% fossil is the average and other places are cleaner. Quebec is nearly 0 and New York buys lots and lots of electricity from Quebec. Then many of us charge at least partially from solar, wind, etc.

 

[JEV]

I'll be selling a 2007 Dodge Ram 2500 diesel when I get the R1T and my solar PV system offsets most of my electric use. I plan to expand the PV system to offset the additional needs of the R1T. I work from home, so no daily commute.

 

[Rivuylkill]

Another thing to consider beyond your own personal impact is that if everyone waited until their cars died then there'd be even fewer early adopters, and without a lot of early adopters the EV vehicles would never really take off, or certainly not as quickly.

I wasn't really in the market for a car, and when I thought about new options, I wasn't really thinking much about electric. But after my wife needed a new car and settled on a Tesla, I can't imagine my next one being anything but electric. Just in seeing ours, I have a neighbor who's now more on board with EVs than he was before and thinking of upgrading, a sibling who's thinking about trading in for one, not to mention other people who've had a bunch of the standard questions about range/charging/etc that I could answer and set them at ease towards maybe buying electric in the future.

Yeah, they're not perfect yet and not without compromise, and maybe trading before our current car dies is suboptimal, but as a whole every little bit counts. Maybe it's just talking myself into buying something more expensive than I usually would, but I feel good about being part of helping things move forward.

 

[Blur1t]

Yes I’ve heard this before but glad he had some data to make it more believable. It’s all steps in the right direction that’s what is the point, I’m so glad to be a part of this. Love what this company stands for, i had deposits down for CT, Ford, and Hummer, I got refunded on all. Might look to Volvo c40 for the wife, that looks amazing.

 

[sub]

Is Keeping your Old Car Better for the Environment?

I haven't watched the video, but based on the title it would seem that the premise relies on the assumption that your old vehicle goes to the scrap yard if you buy a new electric vehicle.

That is an inaccurate premise. If keeping your old vehicle was an option, it shouldn't be going to the scrap yard when you move on to a new vehicle. Someone else will be driving it. The same number of vehicles will go to the scrap yard each year no matter what you choose to do (short of intentionally neglecting/destroying your current vehicle).

The environment doesn't care who's driving the vehicle. To evaluate your impact on the environment, you need to look at your impact on the entire fleet. If you primary concern is what is best for the environment, and you believe that EV is better for environment than ICE, all you need to ask how can you increase the total number of EV's produced. Each EV produced is one less ICE produced.

 

[Scott]

There is so much bad stuff out there. I've caught this guy in minor mistakes but they are always minor. He is orders of magnitude better than most of the garbage one sees and a breath of fresh air for sure.

Yes it isn’t perfect, and in order to make a short video there are often sweeping generalizations, but they are directionally correct and consistently well informed.

 

[Scott]

Another thing to consider beyond your own personal impact is that if everyone waited until their cars died then there'd be even fewer early adopters, and without a lot of early adopters the EV vehicles would never really take off, or certainly not as quickly.

I wasn't really in the market for a car, and when I thought about new options, I wasn't really thinking much about electric. But after my wife needed a new car and settled on a Tesla, I can't imagine my next one being anything but electric. Just in seeing ours, I have a neighbor who's now more on board with EVs than he was before and thinking of upgrading, a sibling who's thinking about trading in for one, not to mention other people who've had a bunch of the standard questions about range/charging/etc that I could answer and set them at ease towards maybe buying electric in the future.

Yeah, they're not perfect yet and not without compromise, and maybe trading before our current car dies is suboptimal, but as a whole every little bit counts. Maybe it's just talking myself into buying something more expensive than I usually would, but I feel good about being part of helping things move forward.

I have an environmental chemist friend who studies air quality and global warming. We had the exact same discussion. My wife and I drive maybe 6k miles a year total. I was making the argument that I probably shouldn’t contribute to the needless production of extra vehicles despite my desire to go electric. Her response was exactly yours: right now we need strong signals to the market that the demand is for EVs and that is what should be built.

 

[ajdelange]

I haven't watched the video, but based on the title ....

That is an inaccurate premise.

Perhaps it might be advisable to watch the video rather than offer your opinion based on the title.

 

[SeaGeo]

I haven't watched the video, but based on the title it would seem that the premise relies on the assumption that your old vehicle goes to the scrap yard if you buy a new electric vehicle.

That is an inaccurate premise. If keeping your old vehicle was an option, it shouldn't be going to the scrap yard when you move on to a new vehicle. Someone else will be driving it. The same number of vehicles will go to the scrap yard each year no matter what you choose to do (short of intentionally neglecting/destroying your current vehicle).

The environment doesn't care who's driving the vehicle. To evaluate your impact on the environment, you need to look at your impact on the entire fleet. If you primary concern is what is best for the environment, and you believe that EV is better for environment than ICE, all you need to ask how can you increase the total number of EV's produced. Each EV produced is one less ICE produced.

he briefly addresses that. Assuming your vehicles goes to the scrap yard and not someone's junker is a conservative assumption that simplifies the analysis.

 

[Mister Person]

This is something I'm struggling with, honestly. I have a 2007 Prius with 100k miles on it that will probably last another 10 years. My current justification is that the kids (15, 14, and 11) will need something to drive so they get the Prius and I get an R1S.

 

[yizzung]

I don't fool myself into thinking that I'm "doing something for the environment" by purchasing a new $80K truck. I want to own a car for lifestyle reasons (skiing, hiking, adventuring...) and that kind of car needs to be able to store my gear, haul my dogs, and power through snow/mud/etc. This is the first electric car that can do that effectively and it happens to look pretty cool too. That's enough for me.

The only way we meaningfully impact the environment is through much more widespread, coordinated action. Norway heavily taxes ICE cars and subsidizes electrics. Share of EVs in US is about 2% and in Norway it's 60%. The Nissan Leaf is the best seller there -- a modest city-dwelling grocery-getter. (They don't have nearly the same number of oil/gas lobbyists crafting their policies.)

The US contributes the 2nd most carbon in the world (behind China). About 30% of what we create is from the transportation sector, which also includes boats and trains. Each of our individual decisions will have so little impact that it's barely worth trying to calculate. If we early-ish adopters help to subsidize the charging network, drive down the cost of EVs, increase competition for Tesla, and make EVs "cool" then maybe that's worth something.

I personally want to avoid anything that continues to prop up oil/gas/coal, so I'm thrilled to go electric but I'm not about to try to calculate the individual impact nor worry about it.

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