Balancing Tire Trade Offs

[jrtozer]

Hi folks, I am contemplating the move from my OEM 21" wheels to 20" wheels so I can get more "durable" tires for the occasional offroad camping segment we enjoy in the Southwest (eg, Hole in the Rock, Point Sublime, Burr Trail, White Rim, etc). I have driven all of these trails on All Season tires in the past without any problem, but don't want to push my luck and get unpluggable tire damage (I am carrying the compact spare and a tire plug kit). At the same time, >95% of our driving is on pavement, so I don't want to give up range, noise, or extra cash for new rims if I don't need to.

Here are some of my assumptions/questions:
Q1: All Terrain Durability: Are the OEM Pirelli Scorpion All Terrain tires significantly more "durable" than my OEM 21" Pirelli Scorpion Verde All Seasons? I ask because for some reason, the All Terrains are only load SL but the All Seasons are higher load rated at XL. Does this mean the sidewall of the All Season tires is stronger (ie, more durable against sidewall damage from the trail)? I'd hate to make the swap and have a less durable outcome. If anyone thinks they are more durable than the All Seasons, please share why. Does anyone think it is crazy/reasonable to drive the All Seasons offroad, somewhat remotely, occasionally (with tire plugs ready)?

Q2: Stonger LT rated tires on a daily driver: Tires with the E load rating are 10 ply (vs 4 ply on the SL), implying stronger sidewalls. But are they too firm (ie, rough) for everyday use? For anyone who has made this switch, is the difference immediately obvious or subtle and something you soon forget about?

Q3: Gentler version of All Terrains: From my research online, I've identified two tires with both stronger E-load rating and All Terrain tread that MIGHT sacrifice some trail aggression for on-road range and quiet:

Michelin LTX A/T2​

or​

Bridgestone Dueler A/T Ascent​

Both look slightly less chunky than others and the Discount Tire website rates them with slightly better than average noise and efficiency. Is this a reasonable way to go given these objectives? I have not had a problem with traction for the kinds of trails I encounter even with All Seasons.

Thanks so much for reading the details of my dilemma and sharing any thoughts you may have.
-JR
2023 R1S in San Diego

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[ksurfier]

You decided to skip the rabbit hole and just get all the way into the quicksand! Each manufacturer has their own design so it’s pretty difficult to really answer your questions in a simple manner. Hopefully someone here can give you there direct experience. LT is what you want from sounds of it…
Best I can give you:

1. Keep 21s with the Michelin Defenders for onroad/commuting use.

2. Buy 20s and get Mickey Thompson Baja Boss for an aggressive off-road /cross-country experience.

hopefully someone who’s done similar can chime in…

 

[Ventura]

There is no right choice. I've been looking for a tire that does it all, but it doesn't exist. Given a desire to not eat into my range (I'm on 20 ATs) I'm looking at the following (both LT 275/65 20):

• Firestone Destination XT
• Toyo ATIII EV:

I figure that since both are light (for an LT) they probably have some structural compromises that will make them weaker than a heavier tire but likely more sturdy than an XL. I think both will give good traction and an OK ride.
I'm leaning towards the XT as I think it will improve my off-road traction more than the Toyo will. It is also supposed to be good in the snow which isn't necessary but nice to have when you get in it. It is supposed to be comfortable and quiet (for a similar tire) but those are areas I'm wiling to compromise on. It is supposed to have no/minimal impact of fuel/range (various reviews) but I take that with a grain of salt. It has white letters as an option so I can revisit the '80s

 

[beatle]

If you've been fine on 21s for the past year, you're probably not really pushing the truck into anything that challenging anyway, and there's really no need for something more durable. Get a full size spare if you really feel the need to spend money on ensuring your trip doesn't end with a flat, or just get 20" wheels if you like the look. A lot of people do, and that's a good enough reason to do it. (It was my reason, anyway.)

 

[RivAW]

Whatever you do, skip the OEM Scorpions. They look good but seem to wear very quickly and they are very noisy (loud drone after about 7k miles.
I feel like I had an exceptional set that lasted almost until 40k miles; but that was pushing it…they probably should have been replaced significantly sooner. The loud drone was very annoying and very noticeable above about 35mph.

My replacements are Falken Wildpeak AT4 and while I gave up a little efficiency (they are heavy), they are quiet, have a significant tread warranty, and are great in rain, snow and ice….and they look awesome!

 

[jrtozer]

Thanks folks, I have ordered the MSW rims and will try E-rated LT All Terrains (Dueler Ascent) to see how significant the compromise is. Worst case scenario is that I need to keep my All Season 21s for use as a daily driver and swap wheels for camping road trips.

 

[CotoR1TDude]

Thanks folks, I have ordered the MSW rims and will try E-rated LT All Terrains (Dueler Ascent) to see how significant the compromise is. Worst case scenario is that I need to keep my All Season 21s for use as a daily driver and swap wheels for camping road trips.

I'm eyeing these myself. Given their performance and relative light weight, and materials EV appropriate. Why did you pass on the Toyo Open Country EV tire (just curious). Not enough time? Looking forward to an update and your experience.

 

[jrtozer]

Update: I am very happy with the Dueler Ascents. I don't notice any noise, and so far I am seeing about 5% reduction in highway range from the 21" All Seasons, which is a good trade off for me. Efficiency might be worse when measured more accurately, but close enough. The truck sits a little taller too.

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