Rants and Raves after 2 months of Rivian R1T ownership [DISCLAIMER: Unauthorized feedback from non-owner]

[AndroidAppBundle]

I have a bias against wasting $100,000. Yes.

I have high expectations for a vehicle at this price point. Even an $80,000 vehicle, I still have a bias against wasting $80,000.

I am trusting on automobile brands to be good stewards of my money. If they play their cards wrong, my vehicle might be worth 40% of original value in 3 years. If they they play their cards right, my vehicle might appreciate in value, like Tesla's do. (Easy to see how Tesla owners can be on their 4-5th vehicle, if each vehicle they get can be sold for above sticker price).

Ford and Rivian both don't seem to know how to make EV yet.

The issue with charging is inexcusable. It's like a fundamental issue that must be resolved, or these vehicles will not be sought out, or desired by anyone. Rivian share price should be half of what it is, they just don't make vehicles that work.....

Like it is absolutely mind boggling how were talking about this charging issue...like 8 months after the vehicles were supposed to be getting delivered. This shows RJ has no idea what he is doing. Could you have imagined how bad these vehicles were 8 months ago?

I had long suspected this is why the key details about Rivian vehicles were never shared; because it were details the general public would not like to answer to.

So just to confirm, Rivian vehicles do not currently support DC Fast Charging? Could they even take 40 amp level 2 charging, or is that too fast for them?

You certainly have a bias against Rivian and looking at the Chicago Pros video Rivian has better paint quality and interior quality than Tesla does after 17 years!

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[Attesan997]

I have a bias against wasting $100,000. Yes.

I have high expectations for a vehicle at this price point. Even an $80,000 vehicle, I still have a bias against wasting $80,000.

I am trusting on automobile brands to be good stewards of my money. If they play their cards wrong, my vehicle might be worth 40% of original value in 3 years. If they they play their cards right, my vehicle might appreciate in value, like Tesla's do. (Easy to see how Tesla owners can be on their 4-5th vehicle, if each vehicle they get can be sold for above sticker price).

Ford and Rivian both don't seem to know how to make EV yet.

The issue with charging is inexcusable. It's like a fundamental issue that must be resolved, or these vehicles will not be sought out, or desired by anyone. Rivian share price should be half of what it is, they just don't make vehicles that work.....

Like it is absolutely mind boggling how were talking about this charging issue...like 8 months after the vehicles were supposed to be getting delivered. This shows RJ has no idea what he is doing. Could you have imagined how bad these vehicles were 8 months ago?

I had long suspected this is why the key details about Rivian vehicles were never shared; because it were details the general public would not like to answer to.

So just to confirm, Rivian vehicles do not currently support DC Fast Charging? Could they even take 40 amp level 2 charging, or is that too fast for them?

I'm not sure there's any proof Rivian has charging issues or any major issues. So far we have 2 prominent views, one from someone with experience with an employee vehicle (but not the owner) and the other a non employee. So far the only thing we seem to know is that a truck built more recently and sold to a customer seems to mostly work without any major issues. There's really not a lot of data points but that should change in the next few months and we'll all see it in real time.

 

[AdamsFan1983]

Wow. So this review came from someone with a predisposition...a bias....in favor of Rivian? As in..... this review could be way worse, if it were from someone without as much of a bias in favor of Rivian?

If that is the case, I don't think we have an accurate picture of just how bad Rivian vehicles are.

A lot of people on this forum had been praising Rivian, saying Rivian will never have Tesla build quality issues, or Rivian will only put out quality vehicles, but they seem to have drunk the Kool aid. At a bare minimum, Rivian seems like a worse Tesla....

Oh brother. <rolls eyes>

Looks like the Twitter bros who bought puts are desperate to undermine Rivian’s reputation.

 

[r1t_kev]

Don’t. Feed. The. Troll.

 

[Polecat]

I look at that review as either an outright lie or at best half accurate. I remember that user wrote up a review a month or two ago on the subreddit but then deleted it a day or two later as well.

Not to say that there could be some truth in there, but I’m much more interested in the reviews from the Jan-May groups coming.

 

[Bobthebuilder352]

Some of these sound like software bugs that should be corrected in the near term. Some sound odd since several reviewers have had these trucks more than a day and othered haven’t reported similar problems, Ie the window controls.
With those things said, the slow rollout gives Rivian a chance to get real customer feedback and respond. If they are actively responding and quickly releasing updates that’s a good sign. I will say, I’d be a bit ticked if my truck was missing accessories when delivered.

Just remember that employees are under a CA for non-positive comments and receive a subsidy on truck purchase.

btw, I’m a Rivian fan and launch deposit holder but I’m also a fan of sunshine.

 

[Iwantatesla]

Don’t. Feed. The. Troll.

I enjoy feeding the trolls though. It’s too fun too watch. I’ve been feeding them over a decade with Tesla.

 

[Iwantatesla]

Does the iwantatesla user work in investment banking, venture capital, or in anyway have a connection to Rivians initial 13 billion in fundraising, and eventual IPO?

Just because they don't work for Rivian, doesn't mean they don't have tens of millions, or billions vested in the success of Rivian.

At the end of the day, we need more data. Because right now, I got a buncha paid-reviews (car and driver, motor trend, etc), and iwantatesla review and the Reddit review.

It seems we got issues, without a doubt, and Rivian just doesn't want the public to know about them - probably because it would be detrimental to their share price, and cause reservation holders to cancel.

The lack of DC Fast Charging support is still mind boggling. Like....how the hell did Rivian sell a EV vehicle that doesn't support DC fast charging?

Nope. I don’t work for any of those. I’m just a dude that enjoys cars and calls it how I see it. I hate this notion I paid this price for the car so I expect this. I also hate this idea that legacy auto is awesome and parts quality is superb. Go drive an EQS with no “halo effect” before and you will be supremely disappointed.

While we’re at it. I’ll disclose. The only shares I bought were the ones that came with the reservation and recently when the shares tapped IPO price.

Keep being miserable and go buy another electric pickup truck (oh wait you can’t). Maybe go work for Rivian and fix stuff for them since you have such high standards.

Sorry mods. If I’m being uncivil, but I need to call out BS when I see it.

 

[Attesan997]

This is the biggest Kickstarter vaporware crapfest I've ever seen. A 20 billion dollar vaporware product......

Unbelievable.....investors actually gobble this crap up

Have Elizabeth Holmes and RJ Scaringe been talking to each other?

Vaporware by definition doesn't exist, that's not true given how much info is out there from people who are driving R1Ts as of today. I was willing to entertain your perspective because there should be a healthy discussion about all issues, and Rivian has made their share of mistakes. But with this statement you've confirmed your intent is to troll. I'm not going to knock what someone does in their free time but I'd imagine there's something else out there more worthwhile.

 

[LaunchGreen]

Data. and I suspect trying to control the experience. Why has Apple always been so focused on locking people into their ecosystem? Remember when they didn't even let you use a different browser on the iPhone?

And until v recently integration of the EV systems with navigation for route planning. VW's nav is a total shit show, but it at least plans you're route out taking into consideration your live battery status.

Apple actually still only has their browser; chrome on iOS is actually just a WebKit (safari) skin and people think it’s chrome (chromium)

 

[SeaGeo]

Apple actually still only has their browser; chrome on iOS is actually just a WebKit (safari) skin and people think it’s chrome (chromium)

You can install Firefox can't you?

 

[astonius]

You can install Firefox can't you?

You can, but like @LaunchGreen mentioned the underlying "engine" of the browser is still WebKit. It gives you the look and feel of Chrome and Firefox, as well as your shared bookmarks, etc, but it doesn't actually use Chromium or Gecko under the hood.

 

[Craigins]

You can install Firefox can't you?

Lol is it the same guy as the other thread? Almost 1 page worth of posts here that I have no idea what they are replying to.

 

[SeaGeo]

Lol is it the same guy as the other thread? Almost 1 page worth of posts here that I have no idea what they are replying to.

No. Just people addressing AA/CP reasoning. Pretty tame.

 

[tmatt01]

Please note that the original post on Reddit was deleted as apparently the person who posted it wasn't the owner and it was an employee truck. See this post for the details: Link to weirdness

Copied from a Reddit Poster. TONS of detailed info we haven't seen before. Some of it is quite concerning, if I'm honest.

This truck is the best "dumb car" I've ever driven. Period. It's crazy fast, incredibly powerful, but also has enough space to haul five people and almost two weeks' worth of vacation gear.​

Below are a lot of complaints, but I can't stress enough how awesome this truck is. The complaints are only meant to paint a realistic picture of my experience - I'd be lying if I said it was all completely perfect.​

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Range​

We're driving our R1T just as we would any other vehicle - we're not hypermiling (purposefully drafting off of semitrucks, stopping cabin climate, or attempting to drive at slower speeds just for range).​

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In the city, suburbs, and just around town (in SoCal), we regularly get a range of 220+ miles at 70% SoC, and ~330 miles at 100%. That's usually in "conserve" mode with no A/C, seat heaters, defog, etc.​

On our trip to the mountains (~20F, snow, "conserve" mode), we were lucky to get around 240 miles on a full charge on the highway, but we usually charged to ~90%, where we got ~215 miles on the highway. "All-purpose" mode dropped range by ~20 miles. When in the cold, we enabled defog sporadically (climate screen needs work - see software section for some context) but didn't use seat heaters or cabin climate that much.​

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DC Fast Charging​

• After ~10 DCFC sessions, the truck just stopped charging past 33 kW. Rivian says they know about the issue (and that it should be patched with a SW update soon), but it really sucked to be at a 350kW EA station pulling just 33 kW. At that rate, it took ~3 hours to get to 90%. The rest of the points below assume this issue is resolved:
  • No plug-and-charge, and you can't filter by EA chargers on the infotainment screen
  • Biggest issue so far: the car doesn't precondition for a charging session - regardless of how you input the station into infotainment. From "cold and dark" to a reasonable charging rate took ~45 mins for the battery to warm up - really sucked at the EA station in the mountains. During preconditioning, the charging rate was stuck at ~25 kW.
  • Max charging rate observed: 205 kW at 8% SoC - lasted for just a few seconds before dropping to ~180kW.
  • Charging curve seems pretty linear - once you hit ~40% SoC, don't expect any more than 150kW. Rate continues dropping until ~40kW at ~85% SoC.
  • From 10% SoC, it takes ~40 mins to charge to 80%, ~1.5 hours to charge to 100%

Build Quality​

Unless you're looking for issues, the car is fantastic. However, as soon as someone points QC issues out, they're pretty difficult to not notice. There are panel gap issues, panel misalignment issues, trim peeling and paint issues, as well as various other fit and finish issues - with no shortage of small tweaks to be made.​

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Comparing to Tesla, this seems on-par with their perceived QC issues. However, I'll give them a pass for now. Rivian is trying really hard to ramp production, and that comes with some sacrifices.​

We also took delivery of the truck with some missing components (no camp speaker, floor mats, etc) - supposedly we'll get them as parts shortages ease.​

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Other than the above minor fit-and-finish issues, the truck itself is rock-solid. No complaints about actual powertrain/mechanical build quality. Handled excellently in snow, rain, high wind, and ice.​

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Rivian Service​

Roadside and Service both have excellent people manning the phones. They're all friendly, responsive, and quick to help. Service itself is kinda slow (at least right now). All of our trim/fit-and-finish issues are going to be fixed in about a month because Service is currently overloaded with deliveries.​

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Software​

Oh boy...here we go. The software itself is just "OK". Compared to a legacy OEM's software, it's pretty good - but compared to Tesla, it leaves a lot to be desired. We're on software version 2021.45.x, and were previously on 2021.25.x. 2021.49.2 is available to install, but failed after ~30 mins.​

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I've seen A LOT of bugs get fixed via OTA updates. No new features, but bugs are being patched left and right - and that's great.​

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There are a ton of complaints and features that are needed, but here are the big ones:​

• Navigation takes the weirdest paths and is just generally kinda bad. Haven't seen any advancements with OTA updates in this regard
  • There is no way to see tire pressures - even though you can get a warning telling you to inflate "a tire" to 48psi.
  • There's no trip odometer or any info about driving perfomance/efficiency or anything to that extent.
• The manual regularly fails to launch - either wait 5 mins or reboot the displays to fix
  • Apps in general sometimes take a while to come up
• Climate control in general needs a lot of work.
  • Climate randomly turns on in random zones
    • Can't control defog intensity - it's either on full blast or off.
    • Climate system relies on outside temp to determine heating vs cooling. If it's 30F outside, but 80F in the cabin, it'll turn on the heater when set to any temp above 30F.
• There's a noticeable lag in some physical controls:
  • unlocking/locking can randomly take up to 10 seconds to unlock (with the fob)
    • rolling up and down the windows has a strange lag to it (always)
    • pedestrian warning system can sometimes take a few moments to turn on once moving
• The app has so much blank space. Right now, all you can do is the following:
  • lock/unlock (relatively quick now, still prefer to use the fob)
    • check range/SoC
    • check/set cabin temp
    • while charging: view charging status and curve (but with no legend or axis labels)
    • request/contact service
    • get current GPS coordinates of vehicle
  • Alexa voice commands + road noise = bad speech-to-text (and therefore a suboptimal Alexa experience)

Phantom Drain​

In the cold: left for four days, lost ~70 miles of range in freezing temps (SoC dropped ~20%). The car supposedly wasn't conditioning the battery during this time, and we only connected to it once via the app when we were ready to leave. Gear Guard was on, and recorded 2000+ 30s events (all cameras recording, so around 11k videos).​

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Elsewhere: left for three days in 40F-50F weather, lost ~50 miles of range (SoC dropped ~15%). Did not connect via app. Gear Guard was off.​

In the garage: drops ~5 miles/day in LA weather with Gear Guard off and no app connections.​

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Driver+ and TACC​

In the daytime, Driver+ and TACC work alright. Phantom braking is very common (especially under underpasses and on strangely patched parts of the interstate).​

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During the night, Driver+ has issues engaging. It'll flash available for a few moments, but then disappear seemingly inexplicably. Once engaged, it works fine. They both seem to work as well at night as they do during the day.​

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It's a shame Driver+ isn't available on more roads (state routes, for example), but TACC is always available. We've taken to just driving manually because of the phantom braking - but hopefully Driver+ will improve in the future!​

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Rivian Insurance​

It's still in its infancy - most things still need to be done over the phone, and it doesn't (yet) auto-deduct my monthly premium. Rates (for this truck only) are far better than 3rd party insurance, but I guess that's to be expected. Services provided through Nationwide.​

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Misc​

Gear Guard records so many videos! Every event lasts 30s and records and stores all five camera angles, even if nothing moved in four of the camera views. Gets kind of annoying, but it's easy enough to delete all the videos if the truck seems fine when we get back to it.​

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Could not figure out how to get the air compressor to work. Supposedly it needs to detect some pressure in order to activate, but that doesn't really help us when we're trying to inflate tubes or inflatable kayaks.​

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No auto high beams​

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Auto wipers work well in the daytime and alright at night (needs some manual triggers)​

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Rear display is still locked. Hopefully it gets unlocked in a future update!​

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The seats are incredibly comfortable - no complaints whatsoever.​

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No homelink ​

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No remote Gear Guard video viewing or alerts - which is fine, but just something I'd like to have.​

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The frunk open/close button is offset to the left just a little - I can never find it on my first try. It'd be easier to find if it were in the middle of the fascia.​

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Summary​

This truck is just...awesome. Mechanically, it's rock-solid. QC and software need a lot of work, but bugs are already being squashed via OTA updates. Overall - fantastic car, would recommend when major software issues are fixed.​

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Just as I finished writing this, we received 2021.49.2. It failed to install, but release notes mention fixing a few of my complaints above (namely defog controls and some app launch/transition issues).​

Good and honest review that sets the table for expectations.

OTA updates are a cornerstone of EVs, but I expect more from Rivian. They've had a lot of extra time to get things right at the cost of deliveries. To give them a pass for being early in the game is not OK. Fit and finish seems to continue to surface is reviews here on the Forum and in YouTube videos. Is this OK with early production cars . . . absolutely not. Each truck/SUV should be going through a QA process with all gaps being gauged. If they fail, they go back to assembly for correction, and staff are retrained. It's simple business. Put poor quality on the road and you get poor customer reviews, which drives away sales unless you're smitten with a name.

Rivian like all new companies has one chance to get this thing right. The car and truck rags have given them glowing marks, but actual owners will provide the day to day insights they can't. This review is a window into what to expect. If you can live with sub-optimal quality and tech, then the vehicle is a no brainer for purchase, but . . . if these items are a challenge many consumers will sit on the sidelines until things get better. Remember Hyundia . . . their quality was awful and look at them 15 years down the road. Rivian needs to figure this out sooner than later to stay on top.

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