Tesla self-driving is so much safer, you get an insurance discount for using it

[beatle]

Of particular note: " Lemonade's new partnership with Tesla provides the insurer with vehicle telemetry data

These guys can all get bent.

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[iansriv]

What an idiotic fucking idea.

Why? What could possibly go wrong?

 

[Time2Roll]

Is Lemonade going to pay for that band saw too?

 

[captainjp]

Tough crowd…
Lol

 

[CrazyOne]

Even though Lemonade is a highly respected industry leading insurance company and not at all using this to generate free publicity and brand awareness, here is some interesting actual data:

Metric	Tesla (Model 3/Y)	Comparable Luxury (BMW/Audi)
Annual Insurance Cost	~$3,900+	~$2,200
Claim Frequency	Highest in Class	Average
Repair Severity (cost)	High	Moderate

Tesla has highest claim frequency in class.

Here is a comparison with Model Y vs the "meatbag" Rav 4

Metric	Tesla Model Y (Long Range)	Toyota RAV4 (XLE/Hybrid)	Difference
Annual Premium (Avg)	~$3,650 – $4,000	~$1,900 – $2,100	+92% (Tesla)
MSRP	~$46,000	~$33,000	+39% (Tesla)

Here is recent data demonstrating that Model Y in the real world is one of the most dangerous cars you can drive despite having very good collision safety

iSeeCars study (analyzing FARS data), which normalizes fatal accidents by miles driven.

• Tesla Model Y: The study found a fatal accident rate of 10.6 cars per billion vehicle miles.
  • This is nearly 4x the national average (approx. 2.8).
  • It ranks as the 6th most dangerous vehicle on the road in their analysis.

Bottom line actual truth: The Model Y has a significantly higher fatal accident rate and nearly double the insurance cost of a comparable RAV4.

Who cares about numbers and facts? This will support the stock and help Lemonade generate revenue.

 

[SwampNut]

This thread was as much fun as I’d hoped it would be. Predictable hilarity.

 

[SwampNut]

Curious how that would be implemented. It says a 50% rate cut while FSD is driving. Does that mean they monitor all of the miles you drive divide the rate by the miles and issue credits for the FSD miles?

Lemonade is one of several insurers that charges you per mile, not per time period, for your risk. So your per-mile rate is half if you are using FSD.

Here's one friend's new Tesla stats, this is how it's determined.

It's fascinating to me that people will cite one or two old FSD/AP failures as evidence that it's bad, ignoring the 30k-some meatbag-caused deaths every year. Hilarious and sad. Humans are so bad at math and statistics.

 

[peace and quiet]

Lemonade is one of several insurers that charges you per mile, not per time period, for your risk. So your per-mile rate is half if you are using FSD.

Here's one friend's new Tesla stats, this is how it's determined.

It's fascinating to me that people will cite one or two old FSD/AP failures as evidence that it's bad, ignoring the 30k-some meatbag-caused deaths every year. Hilarious and sad. Humans are so bad at math and statistics.

Why should I, as a driver have any liability if I am using FSD?

 

[SwampNut]

Why should I, as a driver have any liability if I am using FSD?

Why did you assume you have liability? I was careful to use the word "risk" in my post because there's still a risk of loss to the insurance company. Even a perfect driver still has risk, right?

But to answer the direct, but not relevant question, it's because the laws are behind tech as usual. They will change.

 

[mkhuffman]

As a bag of mostly water, I am not a fan of this level of monitoring, even if it saves me money.

Insurance companies have offered monitoring devices for vehicles for years that will lower your rates if you drive the way they want you to drive. I have no interest in that, or this.

I wish more people cared about personal privacy rights. It seems many are so willing to just give them away.

 

[SwampNut]

I wish more people cared about personal privacy rights.

This has nothing to do with rights. It's like claiming to have freedom of speech in places like this forum. If you have the right to do as you wish with your personal data, then a logical extension of that is to consider whether there's value in trading the data for dollars, no? Having Tesla know that I am using FSD or that when driving, I never brake hard or do other risk-increasing behaviors has zero value to me as privacy, and lots of value in dollars. Easy choice.

Privacy rights are about government, not willing trade with commercial entities. I guard against that invasion of my rights with extreme measures, down to the fact that no government or credit data entity has my actual home address anywhere.

My insurance company offers value to know I don't drive like an asshole? Great trade.

 

[COdogman]

Lemonade is one of several insurers that charges you per mile, not per time period, for your risk. So your per-mile rate is half if you are using FSD.

Here's one friend's new Tesla stats, this is how it's determined.

It's fascinating to me that people will cite one or two old FSD/AP failures as evidence that it's bad, ignoring the 30k-some meatbag-caused deaths every year. Hilarious and sad. Humans are so bad at math and statistics.

Funny how you cited evidence of “meatbag” caused accidents, but offered literally ZERO proof that FSD/AP is even slightly safer I guess you were referring to yourself with that last sentence.

 

[peace and quiet]

Why did you assume you have liability? I was careful to use the word "risk" in my post because there's still a risk of loss to the insurance company. Even a perfect driver still has risk, right?

But to answer the direct, but not relevant question, it's because the laws are behind tech as usual. They will change.

Fair and my question was unfairly simple. I understand the difference between liability and risk.

Based on what I think I know (which may or may not be much) FSD is being touted as being “perfect” so there should be little to no risk to me a the insured.

In Michigan, the owner of a vehicle is compelled to carry auto insurance and agree that laws will continue to evolve but at this point if someone or something is assuming the control of my vehicle, I should not be responsible for the risk.

 

[SwampNut]

FSD is being touted as being “perfect” so there should be little to no risk to me a the insured.

I've never once heard that, even from the crazy person at Tesla.

so there should be little to no risk to me a the insured.

Even if it were perfect, it can't avoid all risk caused by others, right?

if someone or something is assuming the control of my vehicle, I should not be responsible for the risk.

I mean, I agree with "should" but the laws have not been re-written yet.

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