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R1T Wheel v Ford Inboard motors

SeaGeo

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I don't think the Rivian motors are in wheel. Unless I missed something, that's what Lordstown is trying, but Rivian just had a motor at each wheel, not in them.
 
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I don't think the Rivian motors are in wheel. Unless I missed something, that's what Lordstown is trying, but Rivian just had a motor at each wheel, not in them.
That’s what I just read - ‘at the wheel’ not ‘in the wheel’
17 years ago a Virginia Ebike start up took an original smart car Roadster (looked more like a lotus than a current smart) and incorporated a bicycle motor into each wheel.
It was light, peppy, and simple - no differential, tranny, drive shafts....
Just battery, motors, and a very intelligent control system
 

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I sure wish Rivian put their motors in the hub. That with a high-pole motor would make the most reliable system. No diff, no tranny, no gears of any kind. Just two cone bearings.
 

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I sure wish Rivian put their motors in the hub. That with a high-pole motor would make the most reliable system. No diff, no tranny, no gears of any kind. Just two cone bearings.
They would take a pounding in an offroad vehicle. I prefer to have them on the frame where they are not absorbing all that abuse.
 

U100

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They would take a pounding in an offroad vehicle. I prefer to have them on the frame where they are not absorbing all that abuse.
Exactly - in Lordstown’s Endurance the motors are referred to as unsprung mass; i.e. the motors are just dead weight attached to each wheel. In Rivian’s design they are supported by the vehicle’s shocks and suspension system. I know which design I prefer to drive.
 

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I sure wish Rivian put their motors in the hub. That with a high-pole motor would make the most reliable system. No diff, no tranny, no gears of any kind. Just two cone bearings.
Even the Lordstown hub motor have gears, they are not direct drive.
 

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Even the Lordstown hub motor have gears, they are not direct drive.
Really?
I wonder why they don't just make a motor with lots of poles. Those kinds of motors have lots of torque but not as much speed. It is the electrical equivalent of step-down gearing.
 

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Even the Lordstown hub motor have gears, they are not direct drive.
Not according to any docs I have found. Everything refers to it as "gearless". Here is a good read on the Elaphe L1500 used in the Endurance.
 

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ajdelange

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Even the Lordstown hub motor have gears, they are not direct drive.
No. The wheel bolts directly to the rotor.


Really?
I wonder why they don't just make a motor with lots of poles. Those kinds of motors have lots of torque but not as much speed. It is the electrical equivalent of step-down gearing.
That is how they work. Lots of poles. This does not result in more torque. The rate of rotation of the magnetic field is inversely proportional to the number of poles so the field for a 24 pole motor takes 12 times longer to go through 360 ° than a 2 pole motor. To get 12 times more torque requires 12 times the number of turns or 12 times the current or some combination thereof such as 3 times the number of turns and 4 times the current. And or stronger magnets.

Thinking about this a bit more there are more places (poles) where the torque is applied but they have to be smaller to fit,
 
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electruck

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I sure wish Rivian put their motors in the hub. That with a high-pole motor would make the most reliable system. No diff, no tranny, no gears of any kind. Just two cone bearings.
Not me. The added unsprung mass would compromise ride quality and performance which are far more critical in a passenger vehicle than a commercial truck. And while it may be far less complex and more reliable in comparsion to an ICE vehicle, I wouldn't automatically give it a reliability advantage over other EV motor arrangements. I think not using hub motors was absolutely the right decision for Rivian.

Rivians don't have a diff or transmission in the conventional sense. They do have a single reduction gear per motor but I highly doubt this will be any less reliable than the high-voltage electrical and liquid coolant connections that will constantly be flexing with movement of the Endurance's suspension. The Rivian will also have CV joints for the axle half-shafts but, if properly spec'd, should be very reliable and trivial to replace if/when necessary.

And for a variety of reasons, I really don't like the idea of having 3 high-voltage lines to every wheel. That's something I would really rather see well protected in the core of the vehicle.

I have my doubts LM will ever deliver the Endurance to customers but, if they do, it will be interesting to see how they fare.
 

ajdelange

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...half-shafts but, if properly spec'd, should be very reliable and trivial to replace if/when necessary.
Not really relevant to the discussion but I wonder if you have heard about the half shaft situation with the Tesla X. Some of them develop shudder under high acceleration and apparently this is due to a problem with the front half shafts. Replacement is the fix and evidently they still haven't solved the problem. I was at the shop for something minor and when I went to pick up the car they took me back through the shop so I could go out a side door. There in a corner I spied a HUGE pile of half shafts. Wish I'd had the presence of mind to snap a pic. Probably would not have been appreciated.
 

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Not really relevant to the discussion but I wonder if you have heard about the half shaft situation with the Tesla X. Some of them develop shudder under high acceleration and apparently this is due to a problem with the front half shafts. Replacement is the fix and evidently they still haven't solved the problem. I was at the shop for something minor and when I went to pick up the car they took me back through the shop so I could go out a side door. There in a corner I spied a HUGE pile of half shafts. Wish I'd had the presence of mind to snap a pic. Probably would not have been appreciated.
No, not familiar but out of curiosity I just did some Googling and happened across this article regarding a new Tesla Service Bulletin for this apparently common problem.
 
 








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