Should Rivian Consider a 3-Row Version of the R2?

[Electron]

With Tesla expected to launch the Model YL in North America soon (this weekend?), it got me thinking...

Even though the YL is a six-seater and the R2 is currently a five-seater, I think they'll compete for many of the same buyers, especially families and those looking for extra interior space for camping, road trips, and everyday adventures.

Do you think Rivian should consider a three-row R2 in the future?

I'm not suggesting it would replace the R1S. The R1S should remain Rivian's premium flagship. But a more affordable three-row Rivian could open the brand up to a much larger audience. Looking at the R2's proportions, it seems like it could be possible with some creative packaging and a few design tweaks.

The timing is interesting too. With Tesla shifting more attention toward the Model Y lineup, it makes me wonder if there's an opportunity for Rivian to eventually offer a more affordable three-row SUV below the R1S.

I'd be curious to hear what everyone thinks. Would you rather see Rivian keep the R2 as-is, or would you be interested in a three-row variant?

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[UnsungZero_OldTimeAdMan]

Why handcuff themselves and reduce ability to upsell to the larger and more expensive R1, as families grow and their incomes increase over time? Reminder, base trim R1 is discontinued for a reason—price overlap with upcoming top end R2.

Plus, it isn’t as simple as bolting on a row of seats. You don’t know if the chassis is engineered with enough safety considerations to add a row and still meet federal mandates.

 

[justinkitswa]

No way - I'd actually prefer if they offered a cargo 2-seater version, like Tesla does in Europe.
My wife and I never haul people, we haul three dogs. Extra seats for humans means less space for dogs.

 

[SuFFo]

No, they will cannibalize their r1s sales

 

[RivAW]

With Tesla expected to launch the Model YL in North America soon (this weekend?), it got me thinking...

Even though the YL is a six-seater and the R2 is currently a five-seater, I think they'll compete for many of the same buyers, especially families and those looking for extra interior space for camping, road trips, and everyday adventures.

Do you think Rivian should consider a three-row R2 in the future?

I'm not suggesting it would replace the R1S. The R1S should remain Rivian's premium flagship. But a more affordable three-row Rivian could open the brand up to a much larger audience. Looking at the R2's proportions, it seems like it could be possible with some creative packaging and a few design tweaks.

The timing is interesting too. With Tesla shifting more attention toward the Model Y lineup, it makes me wonder if there's an opportunity for Rivian to eventually offer a more affordable three-row SUV below the R1S.

I'd be curious to hear what everyone thinks. Would you rather see Rivian keep the R2 as-is, or would you be interested in a three-row variant?

No. The 7 passenger version is the R1S

 

[Redmond Chad]

I am not sure that cannibalizing the R1S is a bad thing. Some say it is because the R1S is more expensive, but the price isn't what matters - margin is. The R2 costs a LOT less to build, and more sales on the volume platform might help increase margin, making the effect even bigger.

Of course it depends on relative margin between the two platforms, and i don't know enough about their build costs to know know where the crossover line is. They can always make it work by simply pricing new variants higher...as long as the result is still competitive, of course.

I also don't think price overlap is an issue. It certainly isn't with many other oems. For what it's worth, rivian says they discontinued the base version of the r1s because of a low take rate.

 

[CharonPDX]

I think they should offer the originally-announced 5-seater R1S. Some people want the bigger vehicle for hauling stuff, not people.

 

[SANZC02]

I am not sure that cannibalizing the R1S is a bad thing. Some say it is because the R1S is more expensive, but the price isn't what matters - margin is. The R2 costs a LOT less to build, and more sales on the volume platform might help increase margin, making the effect even bigger.

Of course it depends on relative margin between the two platforms, and i don't know enough about their build costs to know know where the crossover line is. They can always make it work by simply pricing new variants higher...as long as the result is still competitive, of course.

I don’t think margin on the R1 is the concern it was initially when the initial buyers like me got an R1S quad for 79k on limited build numbers.

One of the hidden benefits of the more commodity based R2 is lowering the cost of what will be shared components between the R1 and R2 lines lowering the future R1 build cost even more because of the volume discounts.

Trying to build an R2 with 3 rows would require them to make a larger version. The main reason we are getting the R2 is my wife thinks the R1S is too big and wants a smaller vehicle.

My vote would be focus on getting the Georgia plant up and getting the R3 ready for release and updating the R1 to use more of the shared components. The R2 is a great add to the product line but the even smaller R3 should really help open the international markets to really get them to volume builds.

 

[UnsungZero_OldTimeAdMan]

I don’t think margin on the R1 is the concern it was initially when the initial buyers like me got an R1S quad for 79k on limited build numbers.

Except... They did realize they had to raise prices in order to make the math work. Other than that, agree with what you said. Plus, if there was indeed a business case for a 3-row R2, they would have announced it. A handful of would-be takers isn't enough to make a business case to spend millions (and add production complexity). While R2 could hit the median of the market, Rivian is still not there yet with the LE at over $60k all said and done. And while low 50s is the median there is still a large swath of the market that can't afford it. And that's where R3 is critical. Until GA plant is humming and pumping out cars, there's no room for distractions and detours like this. Much can go wrong as is. Biggest problem looming, I think, is microchip shortage.

 

[Millbarge]

I think they would really need to lengthen the wheelbase to do this in a way where the 3rd row isn't just an afterthought. Most 3 row mid size SUVs are 10-14" longer in length than R2.

 

[mkg3]

This is one of those things that initially sounds illogical because the 3 row R2 would take sales away from R1S - and it will.

The Model YL OP mentions started out as China only where the smaller vehicle makes more sense and given their family profile, 6 seater makes sense too. Don't forget that Model X no longer exists so Tesla has a void in the larger capacity vehicle.

The counter intuitive thing is, though, is to do 3 row R2.

Just look at GM and their lineup. If Tahoe/Suburban class vehicles are the only 3 row, they would miss out on those that don't want a larger vehicle but has a need for more than 5 seats.

There may come a day there might be "R2L" where the aft end is stretched to accommodate the 3rd row. Recall that X5 started out without the 3rd row option and now has one.

So, is it this or next year? Probably not. By 2028 - maybe....

 

[SlaterGS]

Personally, I would like to see the R1S with captains chairs and then 3 in the back to still support 7 passengers.

 

[forestwalker]

they should, they could call it... the... R1S. It would be revolutionary.

 

[Hereforthesnacks]

No. That’s like making a 3 row Passport. Or RX.

 

[Golfer04]

I test drove the R2 yesterday. Nice vehicle more "well put together" than my Tri R1T, but is just to small for us. Just my opinion, but they should put a fixed suspension & other cost savings used in the R2 into an R1. According to my Rivian engineer neighbor that would take $17,000 out of the cost. With new X5 EV (which supposedly is larger than previous version) starting at $81,000, 144kw battery, 435 mi range & 10-80 in 20 minutes Rivian will need to do something relatively quickly. Their probably is low R1 sales make every variant more expensive per unit.

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