Will Rivian really build a dual motor option?

[junkanoo]

From the S-1 https://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/0001874178/000119312521321716/d157488ds1a.htm


in the current R1 quad motor, they are Bosch. New models will be in house designed motors.

Much thanks!

It appears that Bosch made its first electric motor in 1914. So to me, the questions become ..

1. Out of the gate, will Rivian's proprietary motor perform as well or better?
2. Will Rivian be able to produce their own motor at scale and when?
3. How long will the motor last?

So ... while I get that Rivian would like to move from being (largely) a design and assembly group to a more fully integrated manufacturer ... given what you've seen out of Rivian to this point ... are you going to trust them to deliver. Or said another way ... is it really that easy to get in the motor business and succeed?

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[Craigins]

Much thanks!

It appears that Bosch made its first electric motor in 1914. So to me, the questions become ..

1. Out of the gate, will Rivian's proprietary motor perform as well or better?
2. Will Rivian be able to produce their own motor at scale and when?
3. How long will the motor last?

So ... while I get that Rivian would like to move from being (largely) a design and assembly group to a more fully integrated manufacturer ... given what you've seen out of Rivian to this point ... are you going to trust them to deliver. Or said another way ... is it really that easy to get in the motor business and succeed?

I believe you can find the answer to all those questions on this site:

https://magic-8ball.com/

 

[DJG]

Much thanks!

It appears that Bosch made its first electric motor in 1914. So to me, the questions become ..

1. Out of the gate, will Rivian's proprietary motor perform as well or better?
2. Will Rivian be able to produce their own motor at scale and when?
3. How long will the motor last?

So ... while I get that Rivian would like to move from being (largely) a design and assembly group to a more fully integrated manufacturer ... given what you've seen out of Rivian to this point ... are you going to trust them to deliver. Or said another way ... is it really that easy to get in the motor business and succeed?

Every major automobile company in history has developed and built their own engines/motors, so I sure hope so. The same will be true for EVs. Lucid already does, Polestar is for the upcoming P3, Tesla does. Building your own has ancillary benefits in packaging and space use so along with battery management systems and software, it's a core competitive advantage. If you don't trust Rivian to be able to build an electric motor, you have no business buying any of their vehicles.

 

[LeoH]

Well, get the Quad motor sell it for profit ( since will have about 15-22K in equity out of the door ) and wait for the dual motor.

At least that is my plan since a 7 seater with an AWD/4WD system is really all what I need, whether its single, dual, triple, or 10 motors makes no difference to me.

 

[junkanoo]

Every major automobile company in history has developed and built their own engines/motors, so I sure hope so. The same will be true for EVs. Lucid already does, Polestar is for the upcoming P3, Tesla does. Building your own has ancillary benefits in packaging and space use so along with battery management systems and software, it's a core competitive advantage. If you don't trust Rivian to be able to build an electric motor, you have no business buying any of their vehicles.

I'd suggest an adjustment to your last sentence to ... you have no business buying any of their R2 vehicles.

There have been so many auto companies that have come and gone and others that exist only because their governments have kept them in business ... e.g. Renault.

We all want Rivian to succeed so much. But ...yeah ... no matter how much I'm rooting for them doesn't mean I should discount the risks.

 

[DJG]

I'd suggest an adjustment to your last sentence to ... you have no business buying any of their R2 vehicles.

There have been so many auto companies that have come and gone and others that exist only because their governments have kept them in business ... e.g. Renault.

We all want Rivian to succeed so much. But ...yeah ... no matter how much I'm rooting for them doesn't mean I should discount the risks.

Eh, perhaps, but I'd maintain it to be true for the current vehicles. If you don't think they can figure out how to build a reliable motor in the future, you should not trust them to build the rest of the vehicle that exists today. Or, alternatively, if you need a ton of data and track record to prove they were able to build a motor, you should require the same for the drive unit, battery pack, etc. on the current vehicles. If a more experienced and mature future Rivian can't build a motor, the competency of less experienced and mature current Rivian should be questionable.

Ultimately, one has to trust that for a company to put out a product, that suggests a level of confidence on their part based on extensive testing that it will be viable. Of course there are examples of this not being true, but far more of it being true.

So, to your last point, you shouldn't discount the risk at all. I'm not saying there isn't risk, but rather the opposite. The question is rather what is your risk tolerance.

 

[BigSkies]

To me, the biggest question is timing. Based on what we've seen so far, I'm assuming "2024" means they might deliver 2x dual motor units by Dec 31 2024 and start ramping production in 2025.

While quad motor is cool, I think dual motors will be better for most people. I'd assume cutting two motors might save maybe 500lbs of weight? I don't really know, but I do know that cutting weight is the best way to improve range.

 

[Trandall]

To me, the biggest question is timing. Based on what we've seen so far, I'm assuming "2024" means they might deliver 2x dual motor units by Dec 31 2024 and start ramping production in 2025.

While quad motor is cool, I think dual motors will be better for most people. I'd assume cutting two motors might save maybe 500lbs of weight? I don't really know, but I do know that cutting weight is the best way to improve range.

Cutting weight is A way to improve range. I don't think it is the best. I think the most energy is lost to friction caused by drag so that is a good place to start (and why Teslas are shaped like eggs) Rolling resistance of tires is another good place. Heat loss within the battery pack, drive electronics and motors are another good place, efficiently heating and cooling the occupant cabin is also important. Minimizing weight is probably lower priority than the ones I listed as far as efficiency goes.
Disclaimer: I'm just a guy on the internet.

 

[dleepnw]

Yeah, I would totally delay my R1S explore reservation for an 800v dual motor variant at the same price. I just don't have use for the quad motor for what we would use the R1S for.

same here. only reason im holding on to my quad motor R1S is the price. were getting a great deal at the pre 3/1 prices.

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