Ford/Tesla Deal: Access to Superchargers, adapter coming, future EVs will have NACS (Tesla) port

[Dark-Fx]

If this happens the pyro fuse will blow and disable the car. You will have a non-operational vehicle but you also will be safe.

I don't think Tesla can blow the pyrofuse on demand but I could be wrong. Relying on a fuse during a significant over current event doesn't strike me as safe. There wasn't supposed to be an overcurrent event.

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[DuoRivians]

You are 100% correct on your first point. They don't need to populate the AC power pins on DCFC but they do need the communication pins from the J1772.

You are 100% wrong about aluminum wires carrying DC. The super dangerous Tesla configuration uses Aluminum for the AC and DC on the same bus bars. See picture of a cross section of the Tesla Model S bus bars.

Not talking about the bus bars, I’m talking about the DCFC *cables*. Your whole argument was about the cost of the wires

They need to be copper, because copper is the only element that allows for flexibility/bending that’s needed on the DCFC cables.

https://electrek.co/2022/02/07/tesla-supercharger-cables-stolen/

 

[MountainRatMatt]

Not talking about the bus bars, I’m talking about the DCFC *cables*. Your whole argument was about the cost of the wires

They need to be copper, because copper is the only element that allows for flexibility/bending that’s needed on the DCFC cables.

https://electrek.co/2022/02/07/tesla-supercharger-cables-stolen/

The cost savings I'm referring to is on the car side, not the charger side.

You are correct though, flexible aluminum wire will fatigue and break before flexible copper wire will.

 

[docwhiz]

That isn't how electricity works.

Try plugging your phone into a wall socket by cutting the USB/Whatever-Apple-Uses cord and plugging the pos/neg wires into the outlet. Current won't flow into your phone's battery until a handshake is made, right? Seriously though, do not do this as it will cause a fire and/or explosion.

You clearly don't understand how electricity works.
Tesla designed their system to accept AC or DC. The comm protocol tells the car what is available. The system is designed to take AC or DC. No danger.

 

[docwhiz]

I don't think Tesla can blow the pyrofuse on demand but I could be wrong. Relying on a fuse during a significant over current event doesn't strike me as safe. There wasn't supposed to be an overcurrent event.

That's what fuses are for...

 

[DuoRivians]

So after all this discussion, I still haven’t heard of a good reason why: a universal NACS to CCS adapter + Tesla Supercharger API available to oems isn’t the better option (or at least just as good).

 

[MountainRatMatt]

You clearly don't understand how electricity works.
Tesla designed their system to accept AC or DC. The comm protocol tells the car what is available. The system is designed to take AC or DC. No danger.

Thank you. Much more elegant explanation than I could provide.

 

[MountainRatMatt]

So after all this discussion, I still haven’t heard of a good reason why: a universal NACS to CCS adapter + Tesla Supercharger API available to oems isn’t the better option.

Cost.

NACS port in the vehicle is much cheaper than CCS port in the vehicle.

 

[DuoRivians]

Cost.

NACS port in the vehicle is much cheaper than CCS port in the vehicle.

It’s not cheaper. You have to add extra controls and chip costs on the vehicle side. Plus, oems give up sticking to an industry standard. Marrying further with Tesla has definite costs—NACS is Tesla IP.

 

[docwhiz]

It’s not cheaper. You have to add extra controls and chip costs on the vehicle side. Plus, oems give up sticking to an industry standard. Marrying further with Tesla has definite costs—NACS is Tesla IP.

It's cheaper because you don't need two sets of heavy (expensive) power cables. The comm protocol chips are already there. It's just software.

 

[Spork8]

You clearly don't understand how electricity works.
Tesla designed their system to accept AC or DC. The comm protocol tells the car what is available. The system is designed to take AC or DC. No danger.

Tesla designed their cars to do this, please reread @DuoRivians posts on this as they are well written. After 20+ pages of messages, you still have not gotten this point yet...? NACS refers to the plug, not the car. Yet you and the other Tesla/Elon stans can't wrap this idea around your head.

 

[DuoRivians]

It's cheaper because you don't need two sets of heavy (expensive) power cables. The comm protocol chips are already there. It's just software.

You don’t need two sets of heavy power cables. Once it gets past the inverter, it’s all the same

 

[Dark-Fx]

You don’t need two sets of heavy power cables. Once it gets past the inverter, it’s all the same

48A 240VAC cables aren't exactly thick compared to other wiring on an EV too.

 

[DuoRivians]

It's cheaper because you don't need two sets of heavy (expensive) power cables. The comm protocol chips are already there. It's just software.

I’m also not talking about the comms protocol. I’m talking about the switch on the vehicle side to accept dc or ac current over wires. There is physical circuitry involved at this level.

 

[docwhiz]

You don’t need two sets of heavy power cables. Once it gets past the inverter, it’s all the same

You need two sets of power cables from the socket to the inverter/charger circuits.
(Sandy Munro explains the cost advantage well)

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