Rivan is #1 brand for Owner Satisfaction in 2025 Consumer Reports survey (3rd straight year)

[mikehmb]

We are talking about vehicle brands ranked by reliability. If we look at all tesla models, the least reliable models are S/X/Cybertruck.

Guess how many of those they sell a year. Not many.

And if the cybercab releases in April 2026 as the drivable variant that has been leaked for months, this car will also eat into model 3/Y sales

We disagree.

So does ... literally everyone else.

https://www.motorbiscuit.com/tesla-model-y-highest-defect-rate/

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[sunydrm]

We disagree.

So does ... literally everyone else.

https://www.motorbiscuit.com/tesla-model-y-highest-defect-rate/

Again if you dig into this the defect was for misaligned headlights. Tesla is loose with alignment because they'd rather fix it later than slow down production

The other issue is rust from use of regenerative braking. Tesla has a brake burnishing walkthrough in the "hidden" service menu.

They also have headlight alignment controls in the service menu. You can adjust it yourself.

 

[Donald Stanfield]

Again if you dig into this the defect was for misaligned headlights. Tesla is loose with alignment because they'd rather fix it later than slow down production

The other issue is rust from use of regenerative braking. Tesla has a brake burnishing walkthrough in the "hidden" service menu.

Why, when everything negative comes up about Tesla, you have some bullshit excuse, but you're unwilling to accept any excuse about Rivian?

 

[sunydrm]

Why, when everything negative comes up about Tesla, you have some bullshit excuse, but you're unwilling to accept any excuse about Rivian?

Bullshit excuse? A software fix is a bullshit excuse? Germany has strict testing requirements.

Are we making excuses as why a rivian R1S or R1T would not get 5 stars on the Euro NCAP test? of course not

 

[Donald Stanfield]

Bullshit excuse? A software fix is a bullshit excuse? Germany has strict testing requirements.

Are we making excuses as why a rivian R1S or R1T would not get 5 stars on the Euro NCAP test? of course not

Yes, it's a bullshit excuse when Tesla knows the rules but fails to deliver on their promise of a functional vehicle. Hold them to the same standard you hold Rivian to on here. I'm really tired of the mental gymnastics you're using to have this double standard.

 

[sunydrm]

Yes, it's a bullshit excuse when Tesla knows the rules but fails to deliver on their promise of a functional vehicle. Hold them to the same standard you hold Rivian to on here. I'm really tired of the mental gymnastics you're using to have this double standard.

This is not a build quality issue in that it takes a couple of minutes to fix and it is a software issue fixable by the end user. This is not the same thing as building a defective car

 

[Donald Stanfield]

This is not a build quality issue in that it takes a couple of minutes to fix and it is a software issue fixable by the end user. This is not the same thing as building a defective car

Yes, it is, because for all you know, most of the defects in the Rivian survey are software-related as well. There's no separating them in the data that you yourself have referenced to state Rivian makes subpar vehicles. So why is Tesla allowed to have software failures but Rivian isn't?

 

[sunydrm]

Yes, it is, because for all you know, most of the defects in the Rivian survey are software-related as well. There's no separating them in the data that you yourself have referenced to state Rivian makes subpar vehicles. So why is Tesla allowed to have software failures but Rivian isn't?

In the U.S. they do not test headlight alignment. By all means, rivian could have headlight alignment issues too

in most states I've lived in they have never inspected my car for anything other than emissions

The difference is rivian does not have any user software to adjust this. You need a service visit

 

[skyguyscott]

When you have a car that is last in predicted reliability, the ownership cost will greatly affect the overall score.

Not sure I understand this metric of "predicted reliability" -- how is that metric gauged? By an objective analysis of materials, QC, supply chains, component testing, etc., or by customer perception, and if the later, how can you predict reliability on a new company with two products that have been out for < 5 years?

 

[sunydrm]

Not sure I understand this metric of "predicted reliability" -- how is that metric gauged? By an objective analysis of materials, QC, supply chains, component testing, etc., or by customer perception, and if the later, how can you predict reliability on a new company with two products that have been out for < 5 years?

you take current issues and extrapolate future issues.

Tesla would likely have improved because they would have fixed previous issues the cars would have had and a larger percentage of the car is model 3/Y

Rivian's predicted reliability will go up if R2 is more reliable over time.

The car will most likely have some issue at first that they did not anticipate.

 

[skyguyscott]

you take current issues and extrapolate future issues. ...
The car will most likely have some issue at first that they did not anticipate.

Ok, not sure what their secret formula is to extrapolate future number of service issues is; but I think a straight-forward category of "service issues" would be a more useful and honest metric.

 

[VSG]

Cybercab production line has been built already. They are arguably further along than R2.

And that's exactly what they were saying about the Cybertruck back in 2019 - Elon made a big deal about how he had learned so much from sleeping at the factory that now he was the manufacturing expert and would be able to deliver exactly what he promised when he promised, and that RJ didn't know what he was getting himself into. Cybertruck was not only promised to be released BEFORE the R1T, but it was going to have almost TWICE the range and cost almost HALF as much as the R1T. (How did those predictions turn out? 0 for 3.)

I don't know why people keep believing Elon's timelines, and keep repeating and defending them. Have you no self-respect after all these years?

Tesla clearly does this as a business tactic - if they are the big gorilla making the best vehicles, and they say they're going to have a harder, better, faster, stronger (and cheaper) vehicle out next year before the R2, what they really mean is that they're concerned about the competition and they want to take the wind out of Rivian's sails (and, curiously, sales) by getting some people to put off buying the R2 because the Tesla is going to be so much better. They're trying to get people to stop investing in Rivian because Rivian is going to be crushed by Tesla "Real Soon Now™".

I suggest you lay off that Kool-Aid for a while - it's frying your brain.

 

[sunydrm]

And that's exactly what they were saying about the Cybertruck back in 2019 - Elon made a big deal about how he had learned so much from sleeping at the factory that now he was the manufacturing expert and would be able to deliver exactly what he promised when he promised, and that RJ didn't know what he was getting himself into. Cybertruck was not only promised to be released BEFORE the R1T, but it was going to have almost TWICE the range and cost almost HALF as much as the R1T. (How did those predictions turn out? 0 for 3.)

I don't know why people keep believing Elon's timelines, and keep repeating and defending them. Have you no self-respect after all these years?

This is 100% different. The cybertruck range was the same as the tesla roadster range. Rivian had the same issue.

It was based on a battery density and cost that did not materialize. That's why R1S is one of the slowest charging EVs. the cooling plate is not sufficient for both layers of batteries. That's probably a big cost issue with R1 is that the battery densities and costs never matched what was predicted.

The cybertruck was an entirely different delay as they did not have the technology to build the truck they had envisioned. They ended up putting new technology into it which is what is also used in cybercab. Tesla probably knew cybertruck sales were doomed based on how expensive the vehicle was getting.


I am literally not repeating anything Elon says as this has nothing to do with Elon at this point. He said the cybercab would not have steering/pedals and that is clearly not the case. There is no world in which tesla can have a cybercab with no steering wheel yet. Self driving is not there

The cybercab production line is built and release candidates are already built. They literally have 100s of castings and they will do a volume production test run in Dec/Jan

I have no investment in any of these EV stocks.

if tesla wanted to take the wind out of rivian's sales they would bring the 3-row model Y L to the U.S.

You can't just bring a new car to market without building the assembly line. People have seen the assembly line because they gave tours about 3 months ago. Everyone is under NDA

 

[Rade]

I remember when JD Power came out with the Chrysler Sebring and Jeep Cherokee as "Most Reliable Car of the Year!" with "...in the initial 6 months of ownership" in fine print. Having owned a Sebring at that time, I just shook my head and wondered who in the Hell they spoke with? CDJR (at that time) got their etched glass award to display in every showroom, and I was left in complete disbelief as I waited on the dealership to figure out why my Sebring was draining batteries dead in 2 months.

That said; >I< was invited to take the rather lengthy Consumer Reports survey late last week. I did give high marks to Rivian based on my year of experience with the vehicle and with the service I've received.

 

[beatle]

Please stop arguing, it's ruining the generally positive vibe of this forum.

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