Poll: What will Rivian do with Max Pack???

[Rivian_Hugh_III]

I’ve had a Max Pack order from the beginning, but I’m starting to feel bad about the pre-March pricing, given the dramatic cost increases for batteries due to inflation. Now I’m wondering if Max will ever see the light of day.

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[ads75]

Why isn’t keep the max pack plan as is an option? Just a troll of a poll.

 

[Rivian_Hugh_III]

Why isn’t keep the max pack plan as is an option? Just a troll of a poll.

There’s never enough options, right? Why not, Rivian will develop its own batteries, Rivian will change the size of Max, Rivian will rename large as max and introduce a teeny pack, etc, etc.

 

[Dark-Fx]

There’s never enough options, right? Why not, Rivian will develop its own batteries, Rivian will change the size of Max, Rivian will rename large as max and introduce a teeny pack, etc, etc.

Rivian will deliver everyone a max pack except for OP and then cancel the program.

 

[LTD in CBTS]

I am a wavering Max Pack hold out. They are 4 months from the first delivery window. It is still on the website as an option for new orders. Since they cancelled Explore I would assume that if they knew they were going to cancel Max they would have done it already. I am optimistic they will carry through with it. However if a Rivian Blue/Black Mountain large pack shows up in the shop, it will be tempting. Currently the only truck I see in the shop is the Packer truck, yellow and green. If I lived in Green Bay, I would be all over it.

 

[shrink]

I’m a failed Max Pack and Ocean Coast holdout. I clearly got the latter wrong - chose a Forest Edge from the shop instead, but I’m okay with it the more I see that stunning wood.

Anyway, I have a second pre-3/1 reservation currently configured for an R1S, but I’m contemplating switching it to an R1T Max Pack. That reservation was made in 11/2021 so an R1S order won’t be fulfilled any time soon. That actually gives me time to see what happens with the Max Pack.

If you all can hold out, pre-3/1 Max pack pricing is a massive deal - especially with the anticipated tax credit.

 

[sacramentoelectric]

I am a wavering Max Pack hold out. They are 4 months from the first delivery window. It is still on the website as an option for new orders. Since they cancelled Explore I would assume that if they knew they were going to cancel Max they would have done it already. I am optimistic they will carry through with it. However if a Rivian Blue/Black Mountain large pack shows up in the shop, it will be tempting. Currently the only truck I see in the shop is the Packer truck, yellow and green. If I lived in Green Bay, I would be all over it.

Would it kill Rivian to offer some sort of update on the Max Pack? There hasn't been a peep in years. Anything to let us know they're still working on it would be great. It would be nice to hear it's in testing with the EPA for final range numbers or some details on how it changes payload capacity.

I don' t think they're going to cancel it outright. RJ said in December that 20% of preorders were for Max Pack. Even if many of those preorders were persuaded to switch to the Large Pack, you're probably still looking at a double-digit percentage drop in preorders if Max Pack is canceled. My money is on Max Pack getting pushed to 2024. If they are considering a delay, I wish they would go ahead and announce it so I can change my order.

 

[Marchin_MTB]

I hate to say this but I think the first two options are most likely. Here is my idle speculation:

They would need to be testing Max-Pack prototypes but we just aren’t seeing that. I can’t see why they would be secretive about that as it can only be good PR.

The max pack might be fairly sub-optimal in terms of design cost (added mass and BMS load) to benefit (power and range) ratio. The large pack is probably already past the optimal point and each kWh added results in smaller range gains. The Hummer EV is likely to be egregiously past this optimal point for the present cell technology in use.

From the battery supply point of view: Every few max pack trucks would result in loss of ability to sell a whole other $90k truck/suv. If the cost increase for the max pack is sufficient, and if there are enough takers, perhaps that would work outbut I’m not sure that’s the case right now.

finally, there is an opportunity cost associated with pursuing the development of the max pack vs putting R&D resources into the next, higher energy-density cell technology that results in more efficient range increases ( maybe solid state maybe a different chemistry). The horizon for that new technology mighty be uncomfortably close to the horizon for a max pack.

 

[LTD in CBTS]

I think those are all very good points. I agree with @sacramentoelectric that they should just communicate. I am willing to wait until 1H23 but not to 2024. If they just tell us then we can switch if we want. I feel like it is too late in the game to quit on the Max without info. I guess that will come in the "end of summer" email.

 

[MountainBikeDude]

I think the Max pack, for which i've never liked the name since they changed it from 180KWh pack, then to Large, now to Max. Anyway, I still think the pricing is enough that Rivian won't lose their shirt over it. I have heard rumblings of issues relating to suspension and components having issues with not necessarily the weight of the pack, but trying to maintain the same payload rating as the Large 135KWh pack. Take that with a grain of salt, it's all rumours.

I've reflected on my need for the Max pack often and kind of keep coming back to the same conclusion, that it was what I originally set my expectation on, and that it's even more of a value proposition for the customer to go for than ever due to the price increase.

While Rivian had a misstep when they increased pricing across the board, I don't see them repeating it again with the Max pack.

Back history of my choice.

When I heard of Rivian and the options available (May 2019) I always had my eye on the 180KWh pack (as it was known then) and while the charging infrastructure continues to grow in Canada, it's nowhere near as robust, even despite connection issues, as it is in the states. I know what driving at most 450km per tank is already like, and having to add to that 30-90 minute stops to exceed that distance in an EV isn't ideal.

We do know range numbers are always a best case estimation. so if I for example, living at sea level in Vancouver wish to drive to Alberta or Saskatchewan because my wife's family is there, my 650km 180kw pack turns into something more like a 500ish km pack because of the mountain passes and gains in elevation. So while yes, it seems excessive for most day to day situations, I'd rather hedge my bet on having the additional range available to me when I need/want it, rather than the alternative.

Also, Battery degradation is a thing, and while some don't own their vehicles longer than a handful of years, I do hope to own the Rivian for some time. I'd rather have the battery buffer I don't need now, so I have a manageable range left in the future. That and the higher charge rate to 80% of a max pack is a big plus! Hehe

Large pack 384km at 80%
Max Pack 512km at 80%

 

[crashmtb]

I hate to say this but I think the first two options are most likely. Here is my idle speculation:

They would need to be testing Max-Pack prototypes but we just aren’t seeing that. I can’t see why they would be secretive about that as it can only be good PR.

How would you visibly, outwardly tell a prototype vehicle is max pack or not?
https://www.teslarati.com/rivian-battery-lab-irvine-california-megapack-production/

I don’t see them binning their long range option after 6+ years of work.

 

[ads75]

Rivian cancelled the Explore option, the cheap less expensive option. Having an option with over 400 miles can give Rivian a bit of a range Halo compared to other brands, and in advertising. Ford wasn't afraid to release a work truck for $40k, and with that one's availability it seems like that one's main purpose was just so Ford and journalists could say F150 Lightning starts at $40k.

 

[Dark-Fx]

My running theory is that the high end trim R2 pricing was going to come too close to the R1 base price. I think Rivian knows they still have some room to go up on their flagship before they start losing sales numbers they can't keep up with. Don't see a reason to axe the up-market options, assuming it isn't supply chain related.

 

[Marchin_MTB]

How would you visibly, outwardly tell a prototype vehicle is max pack or not?
https://www.teslarati.com/rivian-battery-lab-irvine-california-megapack-production/

I don’t see them binning their long range option after 6+ years of work.

That’s a good point, though I would expect them to make a big deal about it… I hope that I’m wrong, I fear that I’m not.

 

[crashmtb]

That’s a good point, though I would expect them to make a big deal about it… I hope that I’m wrong, I fear that I’m not.

I can see it being delayed further due to ”supply challenges”, but it would be dumb even by rivisn standards to eliminate a differentiating feature(more range)

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