RJ Demonstrates Autonomous Hands-Free Driving Aids

[pamalabama]

I don't have to explain it to you because describing it's not my job. I'm not declaring Rivian liars or even saying they aren't lying. What I am saying is you know as much as I do on this, fuckall. The difference between you and I is I will not besmirch RJ's character without PROOF. I think that's rude, and your agenda to be disruptive on here is clear to anyone willing to pay attention.

You need to start doing better and support your claims if you'll accuse people of lying. Again, covering up the camera doesn't prove ANYTHING as there are at least ten reasons I could think of for covering up the camera causing an error. You don't want to see it, because you're just here to shit talk Rivian and cause problems.

I'm getting tired of your attitude, and tired of your lies. Start proving your claims.

PS, the reason I feel confident calling you a liar is you're making declarative statements without anything substantial to back it up. That's the definition of a lie. Even if what you say is true, you are still lying because you do not KNOW it to be true.

if there are 10 reasons covering up the camera would cause an error. Name at least 3

you refuse to accept that RJ could make misleading statements on camera now?

You do realize rivian has every reason to lie about autonomy when the self driving from other brands is getting too hard to ignore.

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[Donald Stanfield]

if there are 10 reasons covering up the camera would cause an error. Name at least 3

you refuse to accept that RJ could make misleading statements on camera now?

You do realize rivian has every reason to lie about autonomy when the self driving from other brands is getting too hard to ignore.

Provide proof of your claims or stop making them.

 

[captainjp]

if there are 10 reasons covering up the camera would cause an error. Name at least 3

you refuse to accept that RJ could make misleading statements on camera now?

You do realize rivian has every reason to lie about autonomy when the self driving from other brands is getting too hard to ignore.

Who gives a shit though? FSD is so overhyped and really the only thing Tesla has going for it right now. I like to drive and be in control of my vehicle.
Tesla’s quality is garbage. The interiors are cheap and uncomfortable and boring. The design is old and outdated and the refresh has done nothing to beautify the vehicles. Changing the exterior lighting arrangement and badging is not a refresh at all. They look almost exactly the same.
In NYC, Model y’s make up a good amount of Uber and taxi vehicles. They’re becoming the new Lincoln town cars, except with the ability to drive itself.

 

[elektrode]

Dang, I got one ignored member dominating this thread as it posts everyone quote replying to him.

 

[captainjp]

Dang, I got one ignored member dominating this thread as it posts everyone quote replying to him.

Sorry ‘bout that. I’d like to ignore him too, but I kinda enjoy the back and forth.
The best one was what he said about seeing three cybertrucks in one hospital parking lot

 

[pamalabama]

Who gives a shit though? FSD is so overhyped and really the only thing Tesla has going for it right now. I like to drive and be in control of my vehicle.
Tesla’s quality is garbage. The interiors are cheap and uncomfortable and boring. The design is old and outdated and the refresh has done nothing to beautify the vehicles. Changing the exterior lighting arrangement and badging is not a refresh at all. They look almost exactly the same.
In NYC, Model y’s make up a good amount of Uber and taxi vehicles. They’re becoming the new Lincoln town cars, except with the ability to drive itself.

you do realize about 10% of people use FSD? So if people were buying the car for autonomous driving it would be very low on the list.

If the car were uncomfortable or had no technology then people wouldn't own the car.

 

[captainjp]

you do realize about 10% of people use FSD? So if people were buying the car for autonomous driving it would be very low on the list.

If the car were uncomfortable or had no technology then people wouldn't own the car.

I don’t realize that. Why would I? People buy the car because it’s inexpensive. There’s a reason why the profit margins for the Y and 3 are so high. The materials are cheap crap and they feel that way.

I didn’t say the tech was bad. The tech is quite phenomenal imo, however it has to be unlocked and comes at a premium. It’s coming up on 10 years and 5 respectively for the 3 and the Y. With the exception of the computing hardware, not much has changed. It’s played out.

 

[pamalabama]

I don’t realize that. Why would I? People buy the car because it’s inexpensive. There’s a reason why the profit margins for the Y and 3 are so high. The materials are cheap crap and they feel that way.

I didn’t say the tech was bad. The tech is quite phenomenal imo, however it has to be unlocked and comes at a premium. It’s coming up on 10 years and 5 respectively for the 3 and the Y. With the exception of the computing hardware, not much has changed. It’s played out.

The reason profit margins are high is they know how to build a car. Materials cost (i.e. vegan leather) is a very small part of overall cost of a car.

The reason rivian can't make money is they slapped 2 ADAS systems, 11 cameras, 2 self driving computers (mobileye and nvidia), poorly designed seats by hyundai, etc.

Rivian's system is stupidly designed for what they are doing. it's like they didn't talk to anyone. If you have a lot of overlapping cameras (like rivian does) you do not need corner radars because you can triangulate position based on overlapping views.

Have that many components in your car and of course it won't be cheap

And if you're going to argue safety, rivian is far behind because many modern cars in 2023+ are integrating solid state lidar units

Low resolution imaging radar is useless because the only fundamental reason to use a sensor other than cameras is to classify objects from far away, i.e. you can classify a pedestrian at night from 300+ meters away

 

[captainjp]

The reason profit margins are high is they know how to build a car. Materials cost (i.e. vegan leather) is a very small part of overall cost of a car.

The reason rivian can't make money is they slapped 2 ADAS systems, 11 cameras, 2 self driving computers (mobileye and nvidia), poorly designed seats by hyundai, etc.

Rivian's system is stupidly designed for what they are doing. it's like they didn't talk to anyone. If you have a lot of overlapping cameras (like rivian does) you do not need corner radars because you can triangulate position based on overlapping views.

Have that many components in your car and of course it won't be cheap

And if you're going to argue safety, rivian is far behind because many modern cars in 2023+ are integrating solid state lidar units

Low resolution imaging radar is useless because the only fundamental reason to use a sensor other than cameras is to classify objects from far away, i.e. you can classify a pedestrian at night from 300+ meters away

Nah. Took Tesla 17 years before they turned a profit. Taking Rivian less than 10.
Boom

 

[EVtowing]

I have not closely followed Rivian’s driver assistance capabilities over the years, but reading this thread it seems some people believe that the company is still using MobilEye and it remains part of the new Enhanced Highway Assist package just introduced. Is their proof for that belief? Rivian’s website states:

The Rivian Autonomy Platform has been developed entirely in-house as a fully integrated system

I’m genuinely trying to understand this, and am not interested in unsupported assertions or simple statements like “Rivian is lying”. State your position and the facts supporting your position. Thank you.

 

[godfodder0901]

I have not closely followed Rivian’s driver assistance capabilities over the years, but reading this thread it seems some people believe that the company is still using MobilEye and it remains part of the new Enhanced Highway Assist package just introduced. Is their proof for that belief? Rivian’s website states:



I’m genuinely trying to understand this, and am not interested in unsupported assertions or simple statements like “Rivian is lying”. State your position and the facts supporting your position. Thank you.

Rivian has been less than forthcoming with regards to its ADAS. No reason to expect that dubious behavior will change any time soon.

They have flat out said they have MobilEye systems, and plan to eventually shift to their own. That said, the info is out there, do your own research instead of completely relying on forum detectives.

 

[pamalabama]

Nah. Took Tesla 17 years before they turned a profit. Taking Rivian less than 10.
Boom

you're missing the point. Rivian sells vehicles at a loss.

Tesla sells vehicles at a gross profit since early model S days.

The model Y refresh costs less than $35K to manufacture. Rivian wishes they could make R2 for that price.

Even if R2 comes for $45K they can't match the base model Y range of 345 miles when your car is a box shape with possibly 25% worse efficiency

The two most expensive components in a car are probably the seats and the battery pack.

 

[pamalabama]

I have not closely followed Rivian’s driver assistance capabilities over the years, but reading this thread it seems some people believe that the company is still using MobilEye and it remains part of the new Enhanced Highway Assist package just introduced. Is their proof for that belief? Rivian’s website states:



I’m genuinely trying to understand this, and am not interested in unsupported assertions or simple statements like “Rivian is lying”. State your position and the facts supporting your position. Thank you.

Rivian has a mobileye system in the car on top of their own system. You cover up all cameras except mobileye. Rivian system drives just fine. Do the opposite and the system freaks out.

Rivian adds a hands free mode but presumably nothing else changes. That means rivian still relies on mobileye.

Rivian many times has been deceptive that they are moving away from mobileye and their own driver assist system is coming out.

It's also suspect that rivian can release a driver assist that has zero regressions over the old version. And the fact that in the video they released they demonstrate an end of line product and using it as "proof" for what the future will hold. Very odd

 

[elektrode]

I wonder if part of the behind the scenes claim is that they are comparing their model’s output with MobileEye’s?

Could they be saying that their system, if enabled, would give exactly the same control inputs as MobileEye and therefore is totally capable of the switchover, even if they haven’t done it yet?

Maybe the camera tape experiment will give a different conclusion with the new OTA?

 

[captainjp]

you're missing the point. Rivian sells vehicles at a loss.

Tesla sells vehicles at a gross profit since early model S days.

The model Y refresh costs less than $35K to manufacture. Rivian wishes they could make R2 for that price.

Even if R2 comes for $45K they can't match the base model Y range of 345 miles when your car is a box shape with possibly 25% worse efficiency

The two most expensive components in a car are probably the seats and the battery pack.

Sure, but Rivian is steadily closing that gap. Also, having gross profit while the company is scaling is very impressive. Give credit where it’s due.
However you want to spin it, Rivian is set up to be successful. I commend Tesla for being successful and blazing the trail, but they can be the only game in town for so long. Unfortunately, the company is probably the most-despised car manufacturer right now. That’s a recipe for disaster. Not only does the coal-rolling right hate them, but also the left is hating on them as well. Tesla can make vehicles at a cost of $10, but that won’t make a lick of difference if nobody wants to buy it.

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