What About That R2 Sunroof?

[Zoidz]

Let me clarify the misunderstanding without it going to illogical extremes. It is not possible to satisfy 100% of course, nor should any OEM try as its a likely recipe for failure with either a bland or confused product. The skilled planner finds the balance using resources available to satisfy most of their own target market. This, however, is such a blantant miss that something else may be happening as there is little conceivable reason for Rivian not to have an accessory solution to the fixed roof, which has many of its own justifications versus an openable roof module. Having a fixed roof is not the issue. Lack of a simple solution for the balance of buyers is. Comments of many Rivian buyers with poor solution attempts I've been reading about this morning highlight the oversight, which would be so easily correctable in the Parts Department, it defies understanding not to be pursued. That is the key point getting diverted by comparing different module types.

It defies understanding only because you have not taken the time to fully research something you have a strong opinion about. Rivian did in fact consider and announce multiple options for the roof during the planning and design phase of the R1. The plan was for the glass roof and a removable panels option. Clearly they thought it through and made their specific design and marketing decisions. It was not a blatant miss as you claim, but feel free to die on that hill by yourself.

During the COVID debacle, they announced that the removable roof panel option was being suspended. Not surprising since COVID upended the plans of established manufacturers, let alone a startup like Rivian.

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[VandalSibs]

It’s mostly manufacturing cost vs all you named. There’s no motorized sunroof, tracks, wiring, multiple spot welds for roof skin and headliner to install. The robots run a bead of sealant and bond glass to it, at one single station on the line. Saving both material costs and time by a large margin. Tesla did it first, at scale with Model S, and opened eyes of auto industry—a way to allow light in and make cabin feel spacious, while reducing a ton of complexity and costs; something they’d never thought to try. In consumer minds, the new cost saving idea registered as a cutting edge premium feature (and now expect it in EVs). Glass is pretty much molten sand. Sand is more common and cheaper than metal. Full glass roofs will become the norm at all price tiers.

The other reason automakers like the big piece of glass as a roof is because it lets them drop in various interior components (seats, dashboard, etc) thru the roof via a robot. It's quicker and easier than trying to get them in via the door openings.

 

[UnsungZero_OldTimeAdMan]

It defies understanding only because you have not taken the time to fully research something you have a strong opinion about. Rivian did in fact consider and announce multiple options for the roof during the planning and design phase of the R1. The plan was for the glass roof and a removable panels option. Clearly they thought it through and made their specific design and marketing decisions. It was not a blatant miss as you claim, but feel free to die on that hill by yourself.

During the COVID debacle, they announced that the removable roof panel option was being suspended. Not surprising since COVID upended the plans of established manufacturers, let alone a startup like Rivian.

This. Anyone new approaching the idea of owning a Rivian, believing they know all there is to know already, but actually just scratching the surface, is just setting themselves up with unrealistic expectations, disappointment and disagreement when they vent and are met with resistance (like this thread).

RJ did a few interviews and podcasts in just the past month that offer great behind-the-scenes insight on what he and team went through to bring R1 to market. Newbies should pay attention to these talks (and less on editorial opinions/hot takes).

In one such chat he said they actually had tooling done for removable roof panels (for R1). But during analysis of mass production plans, it quickly became evident that it would just be too complex in the end—from a manufacturer's POV (financially and ability to maintain a good fit; control of tolerance stacking). They did file a patent, in case they want to revisit later.

 

[Sportstick]

It defies understanding only because you have not taken the time to fully research something you have a strong opinion about. Rivian did in fact consider and announce multiple options for the roof during the planning and design phase of the R1. The plan was for the glass roof and a removable panels option. Clearly they thought it through and made their specific design and marketing decisions. It was not a blatant miss as you claim, but feel free to die on that hill by yourself.

During the COVID debacle, they announced that the removable roof panel option was being suspended. Not surprising since COVID upended the plans of established manufacturers, let alone a startup like Rivian.

I do not understand how this response went off on this tangent about removable roof panels, etc. that I never raised and have expressed no opinion about. The "miss" has been stated more than once in this thread about not making an accessory sunshade available in the Parts Department. If you have more information about an accessory sunshade OEM part that would be a very small tooling investment whether in covered fiberboard or flocked molded plastic, have zero impact on plant complexity, and has margin potential to sell after the vehicle sale that would offset investment positively by an extremely low volume of retained vehicle sales, but so far does not appear in the plan, please share. All these other issues are off topic.

in any event, this thread generated a couple of good leads to solve this problem. Unless there is more helpful information, it seems to have run its course.

 

[ATLRivvy]

I agree with your original "no practical value" assessment for all sunroofs. We'd take a solid steel roof every time. I tried a similar tinted/electrochromic roof on a BMW iX test drive and it was very unsatisfactory with the overhead sun visible, heat felt, and sending in too much light into the cabin for comfort. One of two primary reasons we rejected the vehicle and they void warranty for tinting. Any reason to think the Rivian solution would be superior to the BMW attempt?

No. Don’t buy it. Problem solved.

 

[SDH]

The other reason automakers like the big piece of glass as a roof is because it lets them drop in various interior components (seats, dashboard, etc) thru the roof via a robot. It's quicker and easier than trying to get them in via the door openings.

Did not know that! And that now makes total sense.

 

[Zoidz]

I do not understand how this response went off on this tangent about removable roof panels, etc. that I never raised and have expressed no opinion about. The "miss" has been stated more than once in this thread about not making an accessory sunshade available in the Parts Department. If you have more information about an accessory sunshade OEM part that would be a very small tooling investment whether in covered fiberboard or flocked molded plastic, have zero impact on plant complexity, and has margin potential to sell after the vehicle sale that would offset investment positively by an extremely low volume of retained vehicle sales, but so far does not appear in the plan, please share. All these other issues are off topic.

in any event, this thread generated a couple of good leads to solve this problem. Unless there is more helpful information, it seems to have run its course.

You're acting as though you never mentioned other roof options in this discussion accusing Rivian of "blatant miss". Your post below shows otherwise. Several of us were responding to this with examples of what Rivian has considered. Have a great day, I'm done with your dodge and divert responses.

I agree with your original "no practical value" assessment for all sunroofs. We'd take a solid steel roof every time. I tried a similar tinted/electrochromic roof on a BMW iX test drive and it was very unsatisfactory with the overhead sun visible, heat felt, and sending in too much light into the cabin for comfort. One of two primary reasons we rejected the vehicle and they void warranty for tinting. Any reason to think the Rivian solution would be superior to the BMW attempt?

 

[BCondrey]

Yes, perceived by consumers. Design flaw in the sense that it conflicts with consumer requirements as noted by 9 pages of dissatisfaction in just one thread on the R1 forum! I find it hard to understand that they will repeat the same mistake without a better solution for R2. No desire at all for a "traditional sunroof"....either none at all (steel roof) or a decent quality accessory part to install at delivery to shade/block for the life of the vehicle. Plenty of time to learn more and for them to offer a solution before being asked to convert a reservation to an order. Thanks for the replies to help me realize this is a very open and unsolved situation for now.

Geez. Calm down. Its not a design flaw. Just because a bunch of people on Reddit or this forum don't like it doesn't mean its badly designed. If we took all the people on Reddit seriously no one would ever buy a Rivian. It fits with the overall adventure theme of the vehicles and does not add to the heat as far as I can tell. My granddaughter absolutely loves it.

 

[ENVErider]

Lots of options; I run a regular pin-up model that I paid $50-60 for in the Summer. Some have a reflective silver surface or add on fabric like mine, some only black fabric. I run it full glass Fall-Spring in Nor Cal. If you get a silvered model, expect some plastic ruffling noises when on freeway with windows down. Black mesh alone is quiet.

 

[Oldsmobile_Mike]

I can make it from black PPF essentially but haven't thought of offering it that way...generally It think most people view the sunroof as something positive just want to tone down the heat.

I forgot about this but your comment reminded me -- this company "MEVCO" that makes the vehicles that go down into mines has posted quite a few pictures of their R1T's without the glass roof. I believe the consensus was that they'd just wrapped completely over it, but #shrug?

Also, does anyone remember that OEM Rivian-branded retractable sunshade part that showed up on eBay a year or so back? A lot of discussion at the time, I believe the listing got pulled as it was a "mistake", but photos at the time did seem to show it was an OEM retractable sunscreen removed from a wrecked R1S?

 

[skyguyscott]

You know, bright white is the color that reflects IR radiation most efficiently, even more so than silver. If only car manufactures would paint their roofs white.

Oh yeah, not electric, but whoa! Brilliant!

 

[Sportstick]

No. Don’t buy it. Problem solved.

Even better! Now, the problem will be solved for a lot of us!

https://www.rivianforums.com/forum/...r1s-r1t-roof-sunshades-and-air-filters.50301/

 

[Uncle Dude]

That shade looks good. We live in the Pacific Northwest and my wife is very sensitive to the sun. The feeling (potentially?) of having to wear a hat inside the car would be a deal breaker. Odd they don’t offer an option without the glass roof, or at least provide a quality shade.

I understand the performance of the glass for UV, but the feeling of heat on the head must be uncomfortable at times.

 

[VandalSibs]

That shade looks good. We live in the Pacific Northwest and my wife is very sensitive to the sun. The feeling (potentially?) of having to wear a hat inside the car would be a deal breaker. Odd they don’t offer an option without the glass roof, or at least provide a quality shade.

I understand the performance of the glass for UV, but the feeling of heat on the head must be uncomfortable at times.

It's gonna be hard to find cars that offer this kind of full-glass roof and also a traditional roof. The bodies are engineered differently for each type of roof, and on a mass-market vehicle the more simplicity you can have in the manufacturing process, the better.

Heck, the Tesla Model 3 & Y standard trims still have the glass roof, they just also put in a fully glued-on fabric layer on the inside of the vehicle (which seems super dumb to me...)

 

[rfkxyz]

Had a chat with Xpel guy this past week - got (relatively small) sunroof on my 22 year old Volvo tinted w/ XR Plus.

He said that Xpel advises only 70% (passthrough) or 50% for sunroof, not 35%, 20% or 5%. This is because the tint film will absorb heat as well as reflect/transmit it, which causes the potential vulnerability to the sunroof glass.

I put 70 on the Volvo but would probably do 55 on R2 sunroof when the time comes.

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