R2 vs Model Y 70-MPH Highway Range Test (by Out of Spec)

[rogunenode]

They are "real world" in the sense that they actually drive the miles to determine range. I find that a useful base I can then adjust according to my expected gains/losses based on my real-world driving conditions. They're certainly better than what we get from manufacturer numbers or those reviewers that drive a short segment and extrapolate the full range from there.

But I agree, further refinement to improve consistency and more directly compare vehicles wouldn't be too hard to accomplish. I find Tom from State of Charge usually a bit better in that sense for U.S. testers, when he has the car available to do his standard loop.

Sponsored

 

[MXA121]

Say it again for the idiots in the back!

The R2 has a 96 MPGe highway rating, that is 2.85 m/kWh, that was pretty much spot on to watch they achieved. They were actually above that before they applied some adjustment.

My R1S is pretty close on the EPA ratings as well.

R2 seems spot on to the EPA rating of 96 MPGe highway. This calculator puts it at 2.85 m/kWh. What am I missing?

 

[ColoradoEV]

I'm disappointed, but 2.8 miles per kilowatt at 70 mph is still better than I get with my Ford Mustang Mach-E GT, and with a substantially better charging curve and a more compliant suspension, I'm sticking with my R2 reservation. I'm just better educated now.

 

[SANZC02]

Say it again for the idiots in the back!

I will probably tomorrow…

 

[MXA121]

I will probably tomorrow…

The hero we need right now.

 

[NinjaWrap]

In a way I’m glad the interstate speed limit here is just 60. I can’t complain about EPA range being way off due to testing speed being drastically different.

 

[shandering]

Say it again for the idiots in the back!

We are comparing apples to apples where a lot of manufacturers meet or exceed EPA overall range, even at highway speed

model Y performance is only 4% better than R2 but has an efficiency that is much better than that

 

[blipit]

R2 seems spot on to the EPA rating of 96 MPGe highway. This calculator puts it at 2.85 m/kWh. What am I missing?

We are missing the part where RJ said the R2 matches efficiency of Model Y. But we now know the R2 is 20-26% less efficient across all speeds, including simulated city driving.

I want to see EPA lab test that resulted in 330mile range. That would need to be a combined efficiency of 3.7 to 3.8 m/kwh.

If city m/kwh is 3.38 and highway 2.85 according to EPA...math ain't math-in.

 

[TexasBob]

The R2 has a 96 MPGe highway rating, that is 2.85 m/kWh, that was pretty much spot on to watch they achieved. They were actually above that before they applied some adjustment.

My R1S is pretty close on the EPA ratings as well.

No that is incorrect.

Say it again for the idiots in the back!

You guys know that before you start calling people "idiots" you ought to have some tiny vague clue what you are talking about. No, your conversion number is not at all correct, and yes I know you found it on the internet so it must be true because it's not like they let anyone post anything on the internet... but anyway...

As it happens, the EPA offers this very handy tool if you would like to know what the vehicle's EPA rating is for highway only. You simply set personalization to 100% highway driving and it tells you... the EPA highway only rating is 301 and yes the R2 massively undershoots it.

 

[mroe]

The reference to 96 MPGe (or any EPA MPGe value in my opinion) is not helpful as a comparative datapoint here. It's measuring something else. EPA MPGe as a measurement includes charging loses (see italicized emphasis in the definition here: https://www.epa.gov/greenvehicles/fuel-economy-and-ev-range-testing). The EPA range number on the other hand does not include charging loses and its equivalent efficiency is analogous to what electric car reported efficiency measures — how much energy the battery used for a given distance (not also how much energy was consumed to put into the battery).

You can see this difference pretty clearly by looking at the values published by the EPA and calculating its equivalent efficiency.

The EPA provides the following values for the R2 21" spec:
- 105 MPGe combined
- 114 MPGe city
- 96 MPGe highway
- 330 miles total range

These values correspond to the following efficiency:
- 105 MPGe combined = 3.12 mi/kWh
- 115 MPGe city = 3.38 mi/kWh
- 96 MPGe highway = 2.85 mi/KWh
- 330 miles total range = 3.75 mi/kWh (assuming 88 kWh usable battery)

The EPA range number that Rivian advertises has a calculated efficiency that is significantly above the most efficient MPGe equivalent — and way above the results of the Out of Spec test.

Using the metrics provided by the EPA, you can back into what they calculate as the charging loss based on the difference in these numbers. The difference of 3.75 mi/kWh and 3.12 mi/kWh suggests 83% charging efficiency according to the EPA where 17% of energy is lost during charging.

So if we apply that correct to the highway MPGe number you get 3.42 mi/kWh or 300.96 miles of range. The out of spec results suggest that the R2 is getting nowhere near that.

 

[mroe]

As it happens, the EPA offers this very handy tool if you would like to know what the vehicle's EPA rating is for highway only. You simply set personalization to 100% highway driving and it tells you... the EPA highway only rating is 301 and yes the R2 massively undershoots it.

Thank you @TexasBob for pointing that out. I just calculated the same number (300.96) the hard way just now above lol

 

[MXA121]

Mental gymnastics. Not worth the effort. My R1T also achieves highway MPGe to the number (albeit that was with a RTT over the bed). You guys can rationalize it however you want. We KNOW that the R2 on the highway gets 2.8 mi/kwh which correlates directly to the EPA MPGe rating. It's there for our benefit. Same as when you buy a gas car, the advertised MPG should be what it gets.

 

[SANZC02]

No that is incorrect.



You guys know that before you start calling people "idiots" you ought to have some tiny vague clue what you are talking about. No, your conversion number is not at all correct, and yes I know you found it on the internet so it must be true because it's not like they let anyone post anything on the internet... but anyway...

As it happens, the EPA offers this very handy tool if you would like to know what the vehicle's EPA rating is for highway only. You simply set personalization to 100% highway driving and it tells you... the EPA highway only rating is 301 and yes the R2 massively undershoots it.

You can read your own screenshot, from the internet by the way.

It tells you that 1 gallon of gas is equal to 33.7 kWh. You divide the 96 MPGe by that 33.7 value and it equates to 2.848 m/kWh.

Again, I am asking what am I missing?

 

[TexasBob]

Thank you @TexasBob for pointing that out. I just calculated the same number (300.96) the hard way just now above lol

Y/w just us idiots in the back

 

[shandering]

You can read your own screenshot, from the internet by the way.

It tells you that 1 gallon of gas is equal to 33.7 kWh. You divide the 96 MPGe by that 33.7 value and it equates to 2.848 m/kWh.

Again, I am asking what am I missing?

The EPA numbers include charging losses

Look for example how it says 35kWh/100 miles

That's the amount of energy you put into the car

301 miles with about 15% charging loss works out to be about 255 miles

Sponsored