Anti-EV agenda

[emoore]

Don't worry, none of us will be alive for the next ICE Age either.

None of us but I would expect humanity will unless we continue on our stupid trajectory.

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[White Shadow]

None of us but I would expect humanity will unless we continue on our stupid trajectory.

Hopefully, humanity will continue. But we're talking about 10,000 years from now and the next ICE Age will still happen no matter what we do to the planet. It's a pretty predictable pattern from what I've learned. And 5 billion years from now, the sun will explode, ending Earth altogether. Humans should be in other galaxies by then though, right? No worries....we have time.

 

[emoore]

Hopefully, humanity will continue. But we're talking about 10,000 years from now and the next ICE Age will still happen no matter what we do to the planet. It's a pretty predictable pattern from what I've learned. And 5 billion years from now, the sun will explode, ending Earth altogether. Humans should be in other galaxies by then though, right? No worries....we have time.

I disagree that we have time. The rapid warming of the planet is unprecedented in human history and will have major impacts on civilization as a whole unless we do something about it. I think life on earth might have another 500 million or a billion years before the sun expands to large and it gets even hotter here. I doubt humans will be in other galaxies but hopefully in other solar systems.

I actually worry more about pollution than climate change. Especially plastics.

 

[White Shadow]

I disagree that we have time. The rapid warming of the planet is unprecedented in human history and will have major impacts on civilization as a whole unless we do something about it. I think life on earth might have another 500 million or a billion years before the sun expands to large and it gets even hotter here. I doubt humans will be in other galaxies but hopefully in other solar systems.

I actually worry more about pollution than climate change. Especially plastics.

Right, the sun will end our planet no matter what. If you listen to scientists, they predict we have about a billion years remaining withEarth being in habitable. Millions of years before the sun "explodes" all of the water on Earth will be boiled off by the expanding sun as it runs out of Hydrogen. I learned about this in school decades ago.

But in the meantime, the planet goes through ICE Ages every 10,000 or 11,000 years, something like that. We can't prevent that from happening. Can we speed it up? That's what scientists say, but not by much. It's happening no matter what we do. But yes, we have plenty of time. Another 10,000 years is many, many, many generations away.

 

[emoore]

Right, the sun will end our planet no matter what. If you listen to scientists, they predict we have about a billion years remaining withEarth being in habitable. Millions of years before the sun "explodes" all of the water on Earth will be boiled off by the expanding sun as it runs out of Hydrogen. I learned about this in school decades ago.

But in the meantime, the planet goes through ICE Ages every 10,000 or 11,000 years, something like that. We can't prevent that from happening. Can we speed it up? That's what scientists say, but not by much. It's happening no matter what we do. But yes, we have plenty of time. Another 10,000 years is many, many, many generations away.

Well technically the sun won't explode, it will expand into a red giant and then a white dwarf, no supernova for our sun.

I agree that ice ages happen for the last few million years but they didn't always. Humanity will be lucky to be around in 10000 years at the rate things are going. We are the only species on this planet that can drastically alter the weather which we have already done.

 

[White Shadow]

Well technically the sun won't explode, it will expand into a red giant and then a white dwarf, no supernova for our sun.

I agree that ice ages happen for the last few million years but they didn't always. Humanity will be lucky to be around in 10000 years at the rate things are going. We are the only species on this planet that can drastically alter the weather which we have already done.

Earth has had Ice Ages for millions, maybe billions of years. We are at the tail end of an Ice Age right now. The planet will naturally warm during this period, right? I'm not denying the concept of global warming, I'm simply saying that it will still happen no matter what we do. The planet goes through cycles of heating and cooling, right?

Consider this: 100 years ago, people were driving Model T's if they could afford to buy a car, right? Actually, 1926 was probably a year where there were still more people using horses for transportation than cars. I'm not sure when that flipped, but I'd bet it was after 1926. That said, the Industrial Revolution definitely caused humanity to put tons of Carbon Dioxide into the atmosphere. But 100 years is such a tiny blip of time in the history of the planet. People like to say that humanity is destroying the planet, but like I said, this is just a miniscule blip in time. And we're doing better all the time. The real low hanging fruit is all the 3rd world countries who have no restrictions on emissions of any kind. Who's watching over them?

 

[emoore]

Earth has had Ice Ages for millions, maybe billions of years. We are at the tail end of an Ice Age right now. The planet will naturally warm during this period, right? I'm not denying the concept of global warming, I'm simply saying that it will still happen no matter what we do. The planet goes through cycles of heating and cooling, right?

Consider this: 100 years ago, people were driving Model T's if they could afford to buy a car, right? Actually, 1926 was probably a year where there were still more people using horses for transportation than cars. I'm not sure when that flipped, but I'd bet it was after 1926. That said, the Industrial Revolution definitely caused humanity to put tons of Carbon Dioxide into the atmosphere. But 100 years is such a tiny blip of time in the history of the planet. People like to say that humanity is destroying the planet, but like I said, this is just a miniscule blip in time. And we're doing better all the time. The real low hanging fruit is all the 3rd world countries who have no restrictions on emissions of any kind. Who's watching over them?

No the earth hasn't had the same type of ice ages for billions of years. Earth was much warmer in the past due to a high concentration of CO2, which we are doing right now. So therefore the earth is going to start warming up quickly unless we do something about it.

Humanity might be a blip in the timeline of the earth but that doesn't mean we haven't left scars that will last for 10s of thousands of years or longer. We have created some materials that won't go away for a long long time. And if we want to continue to live in a climate which humans evolved in then we need to stop altering the climate.

 

[White Shadow]

No the earth hasn't had the same type of ice ages for billions of years. Earth was much warmer in the past due to a high concentration of CO2, which we are doing right now. So therefore the earth is going to start warming up quickly unless we do something about it.

Humanity might be a blip in the timeline of the earth but that doesn't mean we haven't left scars that will last for 10s of thousands of years or longer. We have created some materials that won't go away for a long long time. And if we want to continue to live in a climate which humans evolved in then we need to stop altering the climate.

According to scientists, the first Ice Age that we've been able to prove happened more than 2,000,000,000 years ago. This isn't my opinion, this is what science tells us. The planet will naturally warm after an Ice Age, right? And we're currently at the tail end of an Ice Age, right? Do we agree so far? How much has the planet warmed in the last 150 years? Maybe 1 degree?

 

[emoore]

According to scientists, the first Ice Age that we've been able to prove happened more than 2,000,000,000 years ago. This isn't my opinion, this is what science tells us. The planet will naturally warm after an Ice Age, right? And we're currently at the tail end of an Ice Age, right? Do we agree so far? How much has the planet warmed in the last 150 years? Maybe 1 degree?

Yes you are correct that the first ice age happened a long time ago but not the 10000 year cycle mini ice ages we are in right now.

And the earth has warmed 1.5 C in 150 years which is a rapid increase in temperature over that time. And the last time there was this much CO2 in the atmosphere the earth was a lot warmer millions of years ago. It's just going to take time for the earth to warm up with the amount of CO2, it doesn't happen instantly or even over 100 years.

 

[beatle]

So why did I decide against EV? Simple--'I'm going to wait for the technology to mature. For me, EVs simply aren't good enough yet. I want what most people wsnt----faster charging (DC fast charging, not L2), longer ranges, and reasonable purchase costs. Does that make me anti-EV? Not really. I'm still very much interested, but just not a buyer yet. At the end of the day, we all have to make the right choices for ourselves....and for me, ICE is still the right choice. Hopefully that changes soon. I really like that new Cadillac SUV that can do 600 miles on a charge, but its pretty pricey and that big battery takes a long time to charge. We really need SS battery technology soon.

Kinda depends on your use case and where you live. If you have L2 charging at home, you'll use L3/DCFC relatively infrequently anyway - only on trips over ~250 miles or so without destination charging.

I don't tow, and most of my trips are under 500 miles, so DCFC and destination charging has been more than fine for me, but the possibility of seeing a line for charging has been getting higher on longer trips. Years ago I never had to wait to charge, even though charging was slower, batteries were smaller, and stations were fewer. You have to stop for meals and bathroom breaks anyway, and plugging in while you do those is actually more convenient than filling up, moving the vehicle, and then finding a place to do your business.

SS batteries will be a boon to EVs but they're largely not that much of an obstacle to EV ownership if you have home and destination charging. There will be exceptions for higher tier vehicles having extra long range, but I'd wager that manufacturers will largely use widespread SS battery adoption to achieve lighter, smaller EVs and faster charge speeds to make EVs more affordable, not give everything twice the range.

I don't know that your position makes you any more anti-EV than I am for planning to abandon EVs in 17 months for wanting a smaller EV truck that doesn't yet exist.

 

[Gen(R3)Xer]

EVs aren’t going

https://www.donutlab.com/battery/

Bye bye gasoline vehicles. First solid state vehicle on the road in March.

This is not proof of concept -- it is actually a finished production ready unit that has been reviewed.

370 Miles of Range.
200 kW charge rate.
400 wh/kg density.
15 minutes to fully charge from dead to full.

$48,000 in 2026. It only goes down from here.

Before this the best bike got like 90 miles of range and took 5 hours to charge.

I thought the starting price was $29,900? It also sounds too good to be true, but I think what they’re talking about are sodium-ion cells.

 

[Dasoss]

This is an excerpt from an editorial by some generic commentator: Rivian’s rapid loss of thousands of would‑be customers did not come from a botched product launch or a viral quality scandal. It came from a policy cliff. When a key federal tax incentive vanished, a fragile demand story around premium electric trucks and SUVs was suddenly exposed, and the company’s delivery numbers show just how quickly that shock rippled through its order book.

As a sizable sample of Rivian buyers/owners, and EV buyers in general on this forum, does the end of the tax incentive spell the end of EV's? This is my experience: my Rivian didn't qualify because it wasn't "new". Previously I had a Volt and I got about half of the incentive because I just didn't make enough money. It seems like with the cancellation of the Ford Lightning and RAM electric, etc, the EV doom predictors are even more vocal. It's part of the anti-EV agenda. I even saw an article that compared the disappearance of electric vehicles when ICE vehicles became popular in the early 1900's to the current day, and predicted that EV's are going to go away again. Are EV's going to disappear? I've had three EV's (Volts count as EV's depending on how you drive) and I bought them because I like them.

I did not loose out on the tax exemption for my new gen 2 R1S Quad Launch Edition. It cost too much to qualify. There was no incentive for buyers of these cars.

 

[savethemanual]

I did not loose out on the tax exemption for my new gen 2 R1S Quad Launch Edition. It cost too much to qualify. There was no incentive for buyers of these cars.

If you financed the vehicle, you can deduct up to $10k in interest payments now.
https://blog.taxact.com/car-loan-interest-tax-deduction/

 

[Time2Roll]

The climate will be unsuitable for mass human habitation long before the last drop is extracted. The upper limit on the climate's warming is greater than the upper limit of the planet's ability to support 8 billion people.

World population could be leveling off and dropping soon. Reproduction seems to decrease as a country becomes developed. With less people this could soon be a negative population feedback loop.

 

[mkhuffman]

World population could be leveling off and dropping soon. Reproduction seems to decrease as a country becomes developed. With less people this could soon be a negative population feedback loop.

Just in time for AI to do everything for us, since the labor pool will be shrinking.

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