Asphalt driveway problems

[GoBlueR1T]

We redid our asphalt driveway in April (they finished April 25). From the start, I informed them I had a very heavy vehicle, and the owner of the asphalt company and I even chatted about my R1T when we met. They told us to not drive on the asphalt for 3 days but ideally 5 days. With the R1T being so heavy, I wanted to be extra careful. I confirmed multiple times that waiting 5 days to drive or park on the driveway would be sufficient, and that's what we did.

After the 5 days, I parked on the driveway (R1T) for 2 hours (in the evening of April 30), and it left several sunken spots (see pictures; these were taken when it was sunny). I was horrified, contacted the company, and they said they could fix it but wanted to wait at least 6 weeks to let the asphalt settle more (we are on their schedule for August). After that conversation, we parked a minivan in a spot adjacent to the sunken spots left by my R1T, and the minivan also left sunken spots. Over the past few weeks, multiple small marks have been left by various vehicles.

I have been patiently waiting to see if everything is sufficiently addressed in August. However, I walked outside this morning to find a new *horrible* defect in the asphalt (see pictures; these were taken when it was rainy). I think it was left when I parked the R1T there for a few hours yesterday afternoon/evening.

Is this normal? If it is, it's wild to me that I don't hear people complain about it. The asphalt company we used is very reputable (5.0 stars on Google), and many of the people in our neighborhood have used them; I haven't noticed sunken spots or bad defects left in other new driveways.

I know that we were one of their first jobs of the season; I think the asphalt mill/factory/whatever it is had just opened. Is it possible we were given bad asphalt or something? Is there another explanation or is this normal??

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[COdogman]

No, definitely not normal. Was the weather hot in those 5 days after they completed the driveway? I’m just wondering if that could have kept it soft and extended the necessary waiting time.

FWIW 4 years we had an asphalt parking lot and drive done around our building and within 3 days the garbage truck and many other big heavy delivery vehicles were driving on it without issue. This was in spring in CO. Temps were in the 70s-80s.

I would talk to the asphalt company and tell them you followed their directions and this happened. Something isn’t right.

 

[Killer95Stang]

If that is happening with all your vehicles, then I would place the blame on the asphalt mix. I haven't seen that happen. Either way, if the company is bonded and insured, hopefully they will fix this issue, even if it means tearing it all out and starting over.

 

[SparkyR1t]

So asphalt itself has very little strength. It’s all about the base under the asphalt. but your photos look like they used a mix with very little aggregate in it. You may need to have them excavate down 8-10inches ( like you constructing a highway) with a layer of coarse rock then compressible CA6 mix which needs to be compressed with a roller then at least 4 inches of asphalt. You can discuss with your installer the grade of the asphalt. Normally you only want to lay 2” at a time and roll that between layers. For our vehicle weights you basically need to be using roadway standards for long term success

 

[GoBlueR1T]

@SparkyR1t @Killer95Stang @COdogman Appreciate the quick replies! The owner has been very professional and available to discuss the issues with me thus far, so I am optimistic we will reach a good resolution. However, so far he has maintained that this is normal and there are no issues with the asphalt itself. He has said he plans to spot fix the issues in August, but I'm worried this is trying to put a band aid over something that needs radical surgery. Your replies helped validate my concerns, at least.

@COdogman - The weather was not exceptionally hot. Looking back, it looks like it was 50s-70s. And the month of May overall has not been exceptionally warm overall either.

@SparkyR1t - Appreciate the info, but it does go above my understanding of asphalt etc. I attached their initial proposal. Would appreciate any thoughts you have.

 

[Mathme]

I've parked my truck on our 20+ year old asphalt with no problems.

I'd also be leery of "spot fixes" as you paid for one new piece of asphalt on your driveway...not one new piece with a bunch of patches in it.

 

[GoBlueR1T]

I'd also be leery of "spot fixes" as you paid for one new piece of asphalt on your driveway...not one new piece with a bunch of patches in it.

Completely agree. If this isn't normal behavior of the asphalt, I think it needs to be completely replaced.

 

[Underwhirled]

Base and compaction are key; however, there are several different mix designs available. I work with many civil engineers and sounds like SparkyR1t has the right approach.

I share your concern about spot fixes. On our projects, we use a heavy duty asphalt in drive lanes where heavy vehicles will be turning, but even standard mix designs seldom have issues with trucks our weight. I would question whether the compaction was done correctly.

Any construction photos?

 

[GoBlueR1T]

Base and compaction are key; however, there are several different mix designs available. I work with many civil engineers and sounds like SparkyR1t has the right approach.

I share your concern about spot fixes. On our projects, we use a heavy duty asphalt in drive lanes where heavy vehicles will be turning, but even standard mix designs seldom have issues with trucks our weight. I would question whether the compaction was done correctly.

Any construction photos?

Unfortunately, no good photos. They actually did a decent chunk of it while I was out of town.

I *think* the owner said the compactor does 2,000 lbs of pressure or something like that? I know was wasn't very big size-wise.

 

[SparkyR1t]

Proposal is good for a residential drive that has solid material under the base. If you have anything other than solid clay, sand or limestone ( do not want anything like peat or loam) would see if your contractor wants to go a bit deeper with stone. As to the top coat3.5” is standard for residential applications. A commercial drive would be 6”. As long as contractor has evaluated the base material conditions and will guarantee his work then go for it. And if possible to machine roll the base except the edges that the hand plate vibrator is good for I would go that route good luck

 

[Lord Leroy]

Out of curiosity, why do people do asphalt instead on cement/concrete??

 

[Alanparkcity]

Out of curiosity, why do people do asphalt instead on cement/concrete??

In my area (Park City) asphalt costs less and does not have the spalling/cracking issues that concrete has. Areas with many freeze/thaw cycles are hell on concrete unless the contractor does everything right, and contractors will not guarantee there will not be cracking/spalling.

Asphalt requires repair of cracks and regular sealing to last.

After attempts with concrete and asphalt, I now only use pavers. It costs much more but has no issues in the mountains. The base used is roadbed, so the weight of my Rivian does not matter.

 

[GoBlueR1T]

Out of curiosity, why do people do asphalt instead on cement/concrete??

Most of the houses in my neighborhood have asphalt, and it's what our house previously had. I guess it just seemed like the path of least resistance. At one point, I probably did a quick Google search and thought asphalt seemed like the better option, but I do not claim any expertise on the topic.

 

[Zoidz]

My father was a CE and owned a paving contracting company for 20+ years. I worked many summers as a teenager laying thousands of tons of hot mix, so I have a fair amount of hands on experience, as well as learning a lot of practical on the job info from my father. I don't have any formal education in asphalt.

Q: Why did you have the driveway replaced - low spots, cracking, etc. or just the surface was deteriorated? The fact that the old asphalt was removed implies there was structural failure that needed to be fixed properly. This can provide some clues as to what might be happening.

As stated by others, the paving is only as solid as the sub-grade (soil) and sub-base (stone layer on top of the sub-grade). Troubleshooting this from just a few pictures is error prone, but it seems to me that the weight of the vehicle pressed the asphalt straight down, as opposed to displacing it sideways and bulging it outward/upward. If so, this could point to soft sub-grade soil, or insufficient compaction of the soil and sub-base stone. Was it rainy/wet after the old driveway was torn out and before the new asphalt was laid?

It's also possible that the asphalt itself is not to spec. The photos make it look like there is not enough aggregate (stone) in the asphalt or it is really fine. But it's really hard to tell for sure from these photos. If there is insuffcient aggregate, the pavement can deform like this, but it would be more likely to bulge at the sides of the weight depression. This would be an issue at the hot mix plant, not the fault of the contractor who installed it.

Lastly, there are two things to consider when asking the question "when is it Ok to drive on?". There is what is called "drying time" which is usually 48 to 72 hours. This is similar to "set up" time for glue or "safe to touch" time for paint. It has stabilized to the point that it is Ok to have some traffic on it. But it is most certainly not "cured" to full strength - that takes months, up to a year. During curing, the volatile oils in the asphalt slowly evaporate, causing the asphalt to "cure" and harden significantly. Your driveway is dry but not cured.

Good luck with this. You may need to get an independent third party to evaluate what is going on.

 

[Taz355]

Either the mix was bad but not likely as asphalt plants generally do there own quality control
more than likely the density is low(not packed enough) this can happen for many reasons.
cold day, rained during placing<
you can prove all this by taking densities of the existing asphalt
phone an engineering company and have them test it if you want to prove that it’s bad.

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