R1S Auction Prices Coming Down

[MXA121]

Counterpoint, so far two absolute raving morons have bid on this:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/195558016601?hash=item2d882a8659:g:fi8AAOSwYphjwuHX&amdata=enc:AQAHAAAAoPWCRoKxfrmz3YYOPKOgx8uPZ8HeWmf+ffvtn0a995JnU+GFSN1gxxs4RvElfzllahG0aZiJDTx/ESLiX3zDoyDOVOtXFizfmoPtLZh+VzlcJXLRgl/S3e52zzJtVoeoFaItfj0DJ07TEafFxRf/C8cKfk0LA/HOT4YnwI6/yng3ljUeKcur+CHnv8qiBd5CxC/4WapTksGUBGeEwua07f8=|tkp:Bk9SR_qS4pq4YQ

Wow. The bidders are dense, but the listing is purposefully misleading.
Title: 2023 Rivian R1S
Desc: Brand New Rivian R1S Adventure Package With Large Battery Pack...
You have to dig over a paragraph down to see they are selling the reservation and not the vehicle. Not cool. I know Ebay though, buyer will get to back out no problem. Always sellers fault on that site.

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[Guy]

What surprises me is the R1T prices are now below current MSRP. This would imply once pre March 2022 holders flip the price will go up because any post March buyers will have paid $90k (or thereabouts) so won’t accept $83k like one R1T went for recently.

 

[Zybane]

With R1S's being flipped so frequently now, selling for under $100K and as soon as one sells there is another one to fill its spot. There must be a backlog queue of these. It looks like a max of four R1S's on Cars and Bids at a time.

All these people buying just to flip is going to drive Rivian values down...

 

[MXA121]

The flipper rage continues. I saw there's a Rivian for sale FB group and nearly every posting is a new vehicle without adding miles. I even have a friend and they are planning to flip. Sad

 

[SANZC02]

The flipper rage continues. I saw there's a Rivian for sale FB group and nearly every posting is a new vehicle without adding miles. I even have a friend and they are planning to flip. Sad

I think the flipping will stop pretty quickly. Before my vin was pulled my purchase agreement for an MSRP of 77k was out the door for 87k in CA. If they start selling in the low 90s does not seem like the effort would be worth it especially if not paying cash for the vehicle.

That is unless they are planning on cheating the government out of the tax credit, if that is the plan I hope the government flags the returns with an EV tax credit for additional review.

 

[TexasBob]

I think the flipping will stop pretty quickly. Before my vin was pulled my purchase agreement for an MSRP of 77k was out the door for 87k in CA. If they start selling in the low 90s does not seem like the effort would be worth it especially if not paying cash for the vehicle.

That is unless they are planning on cheating the government out of the tax credit, if that is the plan I hope the government flags the returns with an EV tax credit for additional review.

How is that cheating the government out of the tax credit? Whoever puts the vehicle "in service" is entitled to the credit The first owner gets it even if they resell it. It has worked exactly like this for more than a decade. So, yes, there is still a good bit of room for profit on these vehicles even at MSRP plus sales tax.

 

[SANZC02]

How is that cheating the government out of the tax credit? Whoever puts the vehicle "in service" is entitled to the credit The first owner gets it even if they resell it. It has worked exactly like this for more than a decade. So, yes, there is still a good bit of room for profit on these vehicles even at MSRP plus sales tax.

The tax credit specifically states the vehicle has to be purchased to use and not to resale. Buying it and putting it up for sale with < 100 miles is a very clear indication it was bought to resale and not use therefore does not qualify for the tax credit.

 

[Zybane]

The tax credit specifically states the vehicle has to be purchased to use and not to resale. Buying it and putting it up for sale with < 100 miles is a very clear indication it was bought to resale and not use therefore does not qualify for the tax credit.

Do you have a reference?

 

[SANZC02]

Do you have a reference?

Absolutely, first bullet under who qualifies.

I pay enough in taxes, frustrates me to see people cheating the system.

 

[BoIsADog]

Do you have a reference?

Well the tax law (I.R.C. § 25E(c)(3)(B), and it's neatly narrated by the IRS. Note, no resale goes for the old rules pre 2023 (per IRC Section 30D) and new 2023 rules (IRC Section 25E.). It's always been there.

https://www.irs.gov/credits-deductions/used-clean-vehicle-credit

Who Qualifies
You may qualify for a credit for buying a previously owned, qualified plug-in electric vehicle (EV) or fuel cell vehicle (FCV), including cars and light trucks, under Internal Revenue Code Section 25E.

To qualify, you must:

1. Be an individual who bought the vehicle for use and not for resale I.R.C. § 25E(c)(3)(B)
2. Not be the original owner
3. Not be claimed as a dependent on another person’s tax return

 

[JPC]

Wow. The bidders are dense, but the listing is purposefully misleading.
Title: 2023 Rivian R1S
Desc: Brand New Rivian R1S Adventure Package With Large Battery Pack...
You have to dig over a paragraph down to see they are selling the reservation and not the vehicle. Not cool. I know Ebay though, buyer will get to back out no problem. Always sellers fault on that site.

IT IS UP TO $75K NOW. HOW IS SOMEONE WITH $75K TO SPEND ON A CAR SO DENSE?

 

[NY_Rob]

IT IS UP TO $75K NOW. HOW IS SOMEONE WITH $75K TO SPEND ON A CAR SO DENSE?

Can't fix stupid!!!

 

[Guy]

R1Ts won’t drop any more since they are below the current MSRP and the number of pre March holders flipping will run out before the end of the year. The S has a way to go because far fewer have been made and it is a little bit more expensive than the T.

 

[Zybane]

Absolutely, first bullet under who qualifies.

I pay enough in taxes, frustrates me to see people cheating the system.

I see. I wonder how the IRS would prove though that you just bought intending to re-sell versus getting the vehicle and just saying you "didn't like it".

 

[Revelation]

I see. I wonder how the IRS would prove though that you just bought intending to re-sell versus getting the vehicle and just saying you "didn't like it".

The only thing they can really do is view any relevant public social postings about your intentions and conduct an "investigation" and try to get you to admit your true intentions. Baring either of those, there's nothing they can do.

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