Tesla Charging cannot be the standard NA adopts to.

[carsly]

To play devil's advocate, there is nothing stopping anyone on this thread from forming a company to build and scale a new charging standard that displaces NACS and/or CCS. If there is enough industry animosity behind NACS you may very will pull it off.

Anyone remember the shift from DVD's? There was DivX, HD-DVD and BluRay (which was owned by Sony). As a result of Sony's control over BluRay many companies threw in behind HD-DVD as the 'generic industry standard'. Well, it lost. Anyone still have a HD-DVD player around?

You can form a company, today, and shove Elon & Co. around in every single market in which they play. Rather than complain on a message board, just beat him at his game. That's one of the things that makes America an amazing place to live. And you don't even have to be in America to do it!

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[Zorg]

Your thread is bringing back memories of a similar thread I started months ago. 100% agree that EM has way too much control of charging and that NACS adoption is putting even more reliance on networks he 100% controls.

We need fair and open competition. That is why a group of automakers have come together to form a coalition to develop tens of thousands of L3 chargers that have NACS AND CCS.

To those of you on this forum dancing on CCS's grave. Keep dancing. It won't change a thing.

CCS will never die because IT IS THE STANDARD in Europe and that will never change. In the US, CCS will continue to be provided for legacy support indefinitely and there are still OEM holdouts who have not fully committed to NACS and are part of that partnership building their own network.

https://www.autoweek.com/news/indus...makers-to-build-network-of-30000-ev-chargers/

Talk about trying to relive a lost battle. NACS has won in NA. If that makes you happy, the communication stack interface is based on a standard (ISO something...). The plug is just a plug, but the communication is a standard outside of Elon's reach

 

[iansriv]

He is a toddler with a big bank account.

I vote to have a sticky for brilliant comments and this one should be at the top!

 

[UnsungZero_OldTimeAdMan]

It doesn't matter what that musky meme-lord does. Leave the tinfoil speculating to the tabloids.

https://www.greencarcongress.com/2023/06/20230628-teslanacs.html#:~:text=28 June 2023,charging stations across North America.

SAE International will standardize the Tesla-developed North American Charging Standard (NACS) connector. This will ensure that any supplier or manufacturer will be able to use, manufacture, or deploy the NACS connector on electric vehicles (EVs) and at charging stations across North America.

 

[Florida Panhandler]

Everyone relax. NACS will now definitely fall under Monopoly laws and be subject to Anti-Trust action should Elon go nuts (again). The Federal Government might even simply Nationalize the standard as they did with AT&T technology decades ago. As with AT&T, Anti-Trust action can even include breaking Tesla up into separate companies. Elon has shown a clear pattern of avoiding central Government actions against his interests.

 

[Zorg]

Everyone relax. NACS will now definitely fall under Monopoly laws and be subject to Anti-Trust action should Elon go nuts (again). The Federal Government might even simply Nationalize the standard as they did with AT&T technology decades ago. As with AT&T, Anti-Trust action can even include breaking Tesla up into separate companies. Elon has shown a clear pattern of avoiding central Government actions against his interests.

Even though I am not a lawyer, I can 100% assure you that the conditions required to trigger an anti trust action are not even remotely present.

 

[1T2022]

don't be sour loser. If one don't like it, try to come up a better charger
This is the case small size wins, even for w....

 

[Mooeymoose]

I kinda like Elon since he just does stuff. Yes, he can be annoying, childish and rather impulsive but I think we need the crazies. I respect the fact that his domination in fields are in new frontiers. I dont see a negative about NAS. It does allow Tesla to turn charging in to a billion dollar business but other can get in the game to compete with him.

 

[SASSquatch]

Talk about trying to relive a lost battle. NACS has won in NA. If that makes you happy, the communication stack interface is based on a standard (ISO something...). The plug is just a plug, but the communication is a standard outside of Elon's reach

It was never about NACS vs CCS it was about not ceding so much control of vital charging infrastructure to EM. The group of OEMS who are building a network of CCS/NACS chargers are offering a counterweight as I had hoped they would.

 

[Zorg]

My guess is that we won't have a meaningful alternative to Tesla network for another 4-5 years. Good news is that Rivian seems to be hitting its stride rolling out RAN.

 

[Electrified Outdoors]

I get your concerns but a couple notes. Tesla is not a private company they are publicly held. Musk is not in control of Tesla...he has accountability to the board and shareholders.

CCS is bulky and cumbersome to use. In Europe they use CCS2 and not CCS1 like we have here. The NACS is just a better connector all around.

I think we should be happy about it and not too concerned. I agree Musk is kind of impulsive and I don't agree with a lot of what he says/does.

 

[ohseedee]

I really can’t understand people having strong opinions about the future of EV charging based on a single specific human that is associated with a company that designed a standard. I’ve seen zero logical arguments on why NACS is bad and why the move to NACS is bad without also mentioning a specific person by name. I just don’t have enough hate and/or fear in me to influence the cars I drive and how I charge. Instead I’m more focused on my actual real life, and my real experiences with real things. If this person relocated to Mars and cut off all communication with Earth, would people then be cool with NACS? Very irrational in my opinion, but that’s what the internet is for I guess, so carry on.

 

[COdogman]

I get your concerns but a couple notes. Tesla is not a private company they are publicly held. Musk is not in control of Tesla...he has accountability to the board and shareholders.

CCS is bulky and cumbersome to use. In Europe they use CCS2 and not CCS1 like we have here. The NACS is just a better connector all around.

I think we should be happy about it and not too concerned. I agree Musk is kind of impulsive and I don't agree with a lot of what he says/does.

Musk controls about 25% of Tesla’s shares, but they require a supermajority to make changes. So without Musk it would require about 90% to overrule him on anything.

 

[COdogman]

I really can’t understand people having strong opinions about the future of EV charging based on a single specific human that is associated with a company that designed a standard. I’ve seen zero logical arguments on why NACS is bad and why the move to NACS is bad without also mentioning a specific person by name. I just don’t have enough hate and/or fear in me to influence the cars I drive and how I charge. Instead I’m more focused on my actual real life, and my real experiences with real things. If this person relocated to Mars and cut off all communication with Earth, would people then be cool with NACS? Very irrational in my opinion, but that’s what the internet is for I guess, so carry on.

I don’t think anyone here actually did that, but it seems like common sense to not allow any one individual ownership over the charging connector everyone wants to make the standard. If that one individual happens to be a thin skinned man baby, it becomes even more important to not allow it IMHO…

 

[ohseedee]

I don’t think anyone here actually did that, but it seems like common sense to not allow any one individual ownership over the charging connector everyone wants to make the standard. If that one individual happens to be a thin skinned man baby, it becomes even more important to not allow it IMHO…

Yeah but who is doing the allowing or not allowing? The beauty of this country is the people decide where things go (most of the time). The only reason NACS is taking off is because millions of people bought Teslas and charge at super chargers. If as many million bought a nissan leaf and charged at CHAdeMo instead maybe things would look differently. And that could all change tomorrow, if the masses aligned with the thinking here and stopped buying Tesla, stopped charging and SC, and didnt buy any other NACS car in protest. It would work. I’m certain of it. But, most people couldn’t care less and a lot of people love their Tesla. This is a case of a vocal minority and things are moving anyway. The only thing that could slow down NACS is market factors like other auto makers aligning (like they did) on CCS, sell massive volumes of CCS EVs (they are not), and throwing serious money at CCS charging (not yet).

I never bought a Tesla and never charged at an SC, so I certainly didnt move the needle to NACS. Who else protesting can say the same? I was one of the ~50K people who bought a Rivian with CCS. But Rivian certainly isnt moving any needles in terms of driving standards.

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