Physical buttons in a car/vehicle are a bug!

[TexasBob]

I am with Wassym on this one (+/-). Almost every time I need to touch a button in the vehicle, it represents a failure of the technology to do its job.
Touch the screen for nav, station / pocast select? => tech fail. I ought to be able to just say what I want and have it happen. And for most stuff, it ought to just happen without my asking. For example:
Hit the button for Wipers? => tech fail
Lights? => tech fail
Blinkers? => tech limit
Speed adjust? => tech fail
Pointing the air flow and adjusting the temperature? => tech fail
At the least I ought to be able to say "Rivian, I'm hot" and it can handle the rest, but tbh I really should never have to say I'm hot because the vehicle should know that from the in cabin camera's infrared band.

On the other hand... until the tech does not fail (which it does a LOT), it is the obligation of the OEM to provide easy to use, intuitive physical controls. So Wassym needs to embrace his love of clickers at least until he can get the d@mn auto wipers working or get Alexa to be something better than completely and wholly incompetent when you ask it to "navigate to _____"

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[SwampNut]

I've been saying this for years. Buttons suck. Also, I didn't even notice this for years, but neither my Tesla nor Rivian have markings on the steering wheel buttons. Because they are intuitive! If you have to mark them, you failed.

 

[NY_Rob]

To each his own... some vehicles have buttons and knobs plus they are mirrored on the touchscreen as well so you can also use the touchscreen for the same functions if you like that better. You are not locked in to either, it's a nice option.

One thing.. if traveling on bumpy roads, roads under construction or offroad.. physical buttons and knobs are way easier to use then touchscreens where you have nothing to rest/stabilize your hand on and makes actually hitting the touchscreen button difficult and potentially distracting.

 

[Zoidz]

To each his own... some vehicles have buttons and knobs plus they are mirrored on the touchscreen as well so you can also use the touchscreen for the same functions if you like that better. You are not locked in to either, it's a nice option.

One thing.. if traveling on bumpy roads, roads under construction or offroad.. physical buttons and knobs are way easier to use then touchscreens where you have nothing to rest/stabilize your hand on and makes actually hitting the touchscreen button difficult and potentially distracting.

Agree, it's not "one size fits all" especially for commonly/frequently used controls, such as audio volume. I use Alexa voice commands, but if I am talking to somone in the car and I want to the turn the volume of the music down, I should not have to verbally interrupt the person who is speaking to me to tell Alexa to turn down the audio volume.

 

[Surferdude]

Touchscreen controls are dangerous as they force drivers to take their eyes off the road, or at least for longer durations than they would with tactile controls. Just fractions of seconds of eyes off the road can be the difference between an accident or no accident.

They are also far less convenient to use, especially when you're not driving on perfectly smooth pavement (in my area this doesn't exist anywhere). I am constantly finding myself pecking away trying to hit the right area of the screen. There are countless studies out there that prove touchscreen controls are a form of technological regression since they don't improve the user experience and they definitely don't make it safer. I would not be surprised if the NHTSA comes out with guidance in the near future requiring tactile control of some commonly used controls. At least Scout got it right. The inclusion of tactile controls has been well-received by virtually everyone reviewing their vehicles.

Voice controls are great for certain functions like the one example noted in the article (navigation). But utilizing it to do simple tasks like adjust volume or HVAC controls is IMO not an intelligent application. I'm sure there are people that love to interrupt phone calls or have "AI" voice controls abruptly change settings on its own because you accidentally said something that sounds like "increase volume", but I would think this would be a minority of car buyers out there.

 

[R1Thor]

Third is privacy concerns. I don't need my device uploading my voice and saving it to the cloud with all the tech going around to clone voices. I don't like the idea of my software listening to me unprompted as well. It's like carrying around a bug that spies on you all the time under the guise of convenience. No thanks.

I would love to learn your luddite ways. No cell phone?? No computer? You must be commenting on this forum via carrier pigeon!!

In all seriousness, the world is listening. There's zero chance your not-using-voice-controls is giving you an iota more privacy (or not) than you already have.

Live life, my man. Paranoia is for people on the good stuff



My personal .02: I love Rivian's screens. I came from a Volvo with TOO MANY BUTTONS, and I almost never touched most of them. Using dials and toggles to find things in menus was WAY more time and effort than a touchscreen. Seriously. And I'm VERY tech savvy.

The reality is: the less fumbling with ANY settings, the better. Knobs, dials, switches--IT ALL requires you to divert your attention, regardless. But the brilliance is that the climate controls are AUTOMATIC--set it and forget it. So, queue up your playlist, plop your butt down and use 1 (or 2) pedals and a steering wheel and zone out (while being very attentive to the road).

The reality is: if you need to fumble with settings while driving, you didn't prepare for your drive. Get in your car 2 minutes earlier than you need to depart and figure it out. Don't be a can't!

 

[beatle]

I've been saying this for years. Buttons suck. Also, I didn't even notice this for years, but neither my Tesla nor Rivian have markings on the steering wheel buttons. Because they are intuitive! If you have to mark them, you failed.

That's because their function can change depending on what you're doing. I actually found the cruise follow distance and speed to be counterintuitive on the Rivian. They are the opposite on a Tesla where scrolling adjusts the speed and the left/right click sets the follow distance.

Ideally some hard buttons would also be user programmable. Additionally, the market for Tesla S3XY buttons capitalizes on the owner's desire for customization (and lack of hard buttons) in a Tesla.

 

[Donald Stanfield]

I would love to learn your luddite ways. No cell phone?? No computer? You must be commenting on this forum via carrier pigeon!!

In all seriousness, the world is listening. There's zero chance your not-using-voice-controls is giving you an iota more privacy (or not) than you already have.

Live life, my man. Paranoia is for people on the good stuff



My personal .02: I love Rivian's screens. I came from a Volvo with TOO MANY BUTTONS, and I almost never touched most of them. Using dials and toggles to find things in menus was WAY more time and effort than a touchscreen. Seriously. And I'm VERY tech savvy.

The reality is: the less fumbling with ANY settings, the better. Knobs, dials, switches--IT ALL requires you to divert your attention, regardless. But the brilliance is that the climate controls are AUTOMATIC--set it and forget it. So, queue up your playlist, plop your butt down and use 1 (or 2) pedals and a steering wheel and zone out (while being very attentive to the road).

The reality is: if you need to fumble with settings while driving, you didn't prepare for your drive. Get in your car 2 minutes earlier than you need to depart and figure it out. Don't be a can't!

There’s always one person who seems to need to point out that my privacy is compromised in a number of ways but that is a fallacy. Why bother locking your doors when someone can just break the lock?

Online privacy isn’t an either or proposition and you can and should decide your level of exposure for yourself. You have no idea what I do or do not do to limit my exposure and online footprint. No doubt I am more compromised than I would be if I lived in a cabin in the woods but we have to balance being able to function in society with anonymity.

Voice is just another door that doesn’t need to be opened and my phone isn’t listening to my non phone conversations with voice enabling off. I’m aware that the NSA could if they wanted to and there isn’t much to be done about it short of special phone hardware. Regardless if you don’t care at all about your privacy that’s fine but I do, and I take many steps to protect it. Could I do more, sure, but what I do is better than most people.

 

[R1Thor]

There’s always one person who seems to need to point out that my privacy is compromised in a number of ways but that is a fallacy. Why bother locking your doors when someone can just break the lock?

Online privacy isn’t an either or proposition and you can and should decide your level of exposure for yourself. You have no idea what I do or do not do to limit my exposure and online footprint. No doubt I am more compromised than I would be if I lived in a cabin in the woods but we have to balance being able to function in society with anonymity.

Voice is just another door that doesn’t need to be opened and my phone isn’t listening to my non phone conversations with voice enabling off. I’m aware that the NSA could if they wanted to and there isn’t much to be done about it short of special phone hardware. Regardless if you don’t care at all about your privacy that’s fine but I do, and I take many steps to protect it. Could I do more, sure, but what I do is better than most people.

I'm not here to start an argument, my friend.

I typed up an impassioned, informed, and probably alarming discussion point, but let's just put it this way: you're not moving that needle forward by disabling voice commands in your truck. This isn't fallacy, it's reality. It's a fallacy to think you've made a meaningful impact on your privacy by disabling anything. Because the reality is: if they're collecting data on you, they're collecting data on you regardless of whether or not you flipped that switch.

Be well!

 

[Donald Stanfield]

I'm not here to start an argument, my friend.

I typed up an impassioned, informed, and probably alarming discussion point, but let's just put it this way: you're not moving that needle forward by disabling voice commands in your truck. This isn't fallacy, it's reality. It's a fallacy to think you've made a meaningful impact on your privacy by disabling anything. Because the reality is: if they're collecting data on you, they're collecting data on you regardless of whether or not you flipped that switch.

Be well!

No doubt they are collecting data, but what data and how much varies by activity. According to Rivian’s privacy policy they aren’t selling your telematics but you should read the terms and conditions on using Alexa.

 

[usofrob]

I was also alarmed at reading about his comments. I'm happy that they're working towards making voice better, as it's currently pointless. I use the Navigate to, and play song on my Tesla quite regularly. It'd be great if those worked. But, I wouldn't want to say "Roll up my window to 70%". I mostly just don't like talking to things. I wouldn't want to talk to my wife to skip to the next song. I wouldn't want to turn down the volume to talk to my computer. Many things just take less time and are easier with buttons.

 

[ThirteenElectrics]

Wassym’s comments make sense when viewed through the lens of self-interest. He is in charge of software, it increases his power within the company if everything goes through his software.

When people are talking or sleeping in the car, or when you’re enjoying silence or music, voice control doesn’t work. For quick adjustments, voice control doesn’t work. I want to turn on the seat heater with a knob and know it’s set to 2 when I feel two clicks. I don’t want to have to say it and then have the car read aloud back to me like a slack jawed yokel to confirm what it is doing. Similarly, it’s quicker for me to tap three times to skip three songs ahead, or skip back a track. Half a second vs two or three seconds. Voice interfaces are a lot of labor and a lot of listening. And using screens require me to take my eyes off the road, even worse.

Most things should be doable keeping my eyes on the road and using muscle memory to press a button, then get tactile feedback. If it isn’t broke, don’t fix it.

Another motivation for that underlies these stupid buttonless UI initiatives is cost. A set of a two dozen buttons that work reliably for a million presses costs more than a capacitive screen that can be reused. It’s all profit-seeking disguised as other things. It’s kind of insulting how dumb they think we are that we would accept their fig-leaf narratives that compromise safety and ease of use.

 

[elektrode]

Meanwhile the hardware engineers are hard at work making the most advanced haptic wheels/buttons ever seen. And the R2 left stalk appears to be an improvement over the weird mini toggles.

 

[DuoRivians]

I saw the TechCrunch presentation, rather than a click-bait version of an article.

Wassym is basically saying that voice enables a much richer UI that cannot be done with buttons alone.

ChatGPT enabled voice commands, like “tell me some good recommendations for food around me, and book a reservation” can only be done via voice in the car.

Of course you can pull over and do it on the phone. But this is the sort of voice commands Wassym is referring to, not “close my windows”.

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