Sponsored
UnsungZero_OldTimeAdMan
Well-Known Member
neodescis
Member
Very nice. In that area, I highly recommend Ohio Pass. There's a beaver pond there, and the short hike to it has some of the biggest Aspens I've ever seen!Not yet, but a relative has a place in Crested Butte...stunning in the fall!
Luvolbikes
Well-Known Member
I thank the forum administrator for removing inappropriate politically biased posts from this thread. There are plenty of other forums that welcome such comments and those who insist on posting them are invited to visit elsewhere.
Regarding insurance, I pay only around $250 with Progressive for 6 months full coverage for my 2024 guad large R1t. In Arizona. Clean accident history. Retired, multivehicle discount. I deferred on the glass coverage as it would have near doubled the cost. I was happily surprised as I was expecting to pay much more. Hopefully won't see a big jump when I renew.
Regarding insurance, I pay only around $250 with Progressive for 6 months full coverage for my 2024 guad large R1t. In Arizona. Clean accident history. Retired, multivehicle discount. I deferred on the glass coverage as it would have near doubled the cost. I was happily surprised as I was expecting to pay much more. Hopefully won't see a big jump when I renew.
Sponsored
OP
OP
betak
Well-Known Member
- Thread starter
- #37
2011 BMW M3. It was my daily driver before getting the Rivian. Still haven’t decided what to do with it so it doesn’t get driven much. My agent listed it as excess vehicle which then qualifies me for multi-car discount which is pretty significant. I’ll have to play around with the numbers if I remove it completely.
Last edited:
Newtonrj
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Aug 31, 2023
- Threads
- 3
- Messages
- 168
- Reaction score
- 257
- Location
- bloomington, il
- Vehicles
- Porsche Cayenne Plugin Hybrid, BMW 335i, M3, 325i, VW GTI
Insurance rates have been on the rise for a few years. Insurance rate actuary teams use accident and insurance data two years lagging. SO, coming out of COVID, we're now paying for State Insurance Commissioners demanding insurance companies refund policy owners for not driving during COVID. Also, there are several major contributors to higher rates:
- Higher repair costs - Rivian is a new vehicle with higher than average repair costs. Starting <5yrs ago with new models, insurance companies estimated repairs. Now they have actual repair costs. And they are higher than average. Why? Well, only one source. . .
- Limited repair facilities - We have seen many posts here about costs and times for SC repairs. Insurance companies pay full-retail on repairs. Do that all the time and the insurance rates comparatively go up when other ICE models have factory and non-factory repair options. Other ICE options include non-OEM, again something new vehicles do not have. Now that insurance companies have disclosure notice filings of higher repair costs, they are signaling higher compensitroy rate changes.
- Total 'vs' Repair - There have been too many instances of total loss on an effective repair/damage. Again, if a moderate fender-bender totals a Rivian too many times, the threshold for a total loss is higher and actuaries take notice on rate changes. It may have started with battery fears but now has expanded into any number of legitimate reasons for satisfactory repair of a new technology, software defined, non-ICE, by a new manufacturer.
- Inflation - Everything is going up in price. Parts are scarce, labor is high and repairing broken vehicles with only factory available parts is going to be more expensive.
There certainly have been stated cases where State Insurance Commissioners have forcefully restricted insurance market pricing by refusing to allow insurance companies to charge effective (higher) rates. These insurance companies will take that for a while before they simply refuse to write new policies. Or renew them. All in an effort to reduce exposure. See recent allowances by State Insurance Commissioners to allow market adjustments, that translates to a right-sizing of insurance market rates. Expect we'll see rates go up every year above inflation until the actual repair costs stabilize and/or a new market of authorized and acceptable repair alternatives develops as well as market acceptance for these rates
Note the average cost of a new car is $48k with the average cost of insurance at $2,400/yr (or 5% of the total vehicle replacement at new). These vehicles are >2x that cost so easily carry >2x the rates just to average out. Rivians are new so there is a premium for insurance until actual costs average down. When or if that ever happens is a game our wallets have to consider.
- Higher repair costs - Rivian is a new vehicle with higher than average repair costs. Starting <5yrs ago with new models, insurance companies estimated repairs. Now they have actual repair costs. And they are higher than average. Why? Well, only one source. . .
- Limited repair facilities - We have seen many posts here about costs and times for SC repairs. Insurance companies pay full-retail on repairs. Do that all the time and the insurance rates comparatively go up when other ICE models have factory and non-factory repair options. Other ICE options include non-OEM, again something new vehicles do not have. Now that insurance companies have disclosure notice filings of higher repair costs, they are signaling higher compensitroy rate changes.
- Total 'vs' Repair - There have been too many instances of total loss on an effective repair/damage. Again, if a moderate fender-bender totals a Rivian too many times, the threshold for a total loss is higher and actuaries take notice on rate changes. It may have started with battery fears but now has expanded into any number of legitimate reasons for satisfactory repair of a new technology, software defined, non-ICE, by a new manufacturer.
- Inflation - Everything is going up in price. Parts are scarce, labor is high and repairing broken vehicles with only factory available parts is going to be more expensive.
There certainly have been stated cases where State Insurance Commissioners have forcefully restricted insurance market pricing by refusing to allow insurance companies to charge effective (higher) rates. These insurance companies will take that for a while before they simply refuse to write new policies. Or renew them. All in an effort to reduce exposure. See recent allowances by State Insurance Commissioners to allow market adjustments, that translates to a right-sizing of insurance market rates. Expect we'll see rates go up every year above inflation until the actual repair costs stabilize and/or a new market of authorized and acceptable repair alternatives develops as well as market acceptance for these rates
Note the average cost of a new car is $48k with the average cost of insurance at $2,400/yr (or 5% of the total vehicle replacement at new). These vehicles are >2x that cost so easily carry >2x the rates just to average out. Rivians are new so there is a premium for insurance until actual costs average down. When or if that ever happens is a game our wallets have to consider.
Chewy734
Well-Known Member
- First Name
- Ashu
- Joined
- Nov 8, 2020
- Threads
- 27
- Messages
- 1,319
- Reaction score
- 2,732
- Location
- Los Angeles
- Vehicles
- BMW, Ford, Rivian
$1660/6 mo with Mercury for me, just for the Rivian. 
Cycliste
Well-Known Member
- First Name
- Scott
- Joined
- Jul 7, 2023
- Threads
- 11
- Messages
- 1,191
- Reaction score
- 1,671
- Location
- Solano County, California
- Vehicles
- 2023 R1T/20AT Brights, BMC TMR01/SRAM AXS/454 NSW
- Occupation
- Amateur aero weenie
Like, how many Uber rides can you get for $13,500?? Maybe you could tell your wife you are gifting her a chauffeur?
Sponsored
DeafPug
Well-Known Member
You could probably get a 10 year old Camry for $10k and then just get liability insurance and self-insure for damage on the vehicle and come out ahead. Also, the idea of$10k of Uber/lyft credits isn’t bad.
mkg3
Well-Known Member
Wow. Then that is crazy. Our son lives in SF and just graduated working for a startup. When we moved him this summer, we convinced him not to have a car because of parking issues. Had not considered insurance being that much higher.
Well, CA needs new insurance commissioner that brings some sanity into all these rate hikes and insurance companies leaving the state. I know people who are now paying over $20K/yr for homeowners insurance because they back up to open canyon and woods - both in SoCal and NorCal.
Hope it gets better.
jbssfelix
Well-Known Member
- First Name
- J
- Joined
- Apr 3, 2022
- Threads
- 3
- Messages
- 191
- Reaction score
- 384
- Location
- Denver, CO
- Vehicles
- Tesla Model 3; Rivian R1S
That's bananas. We're at $2800/yr for 250/500 with $250 deductible here in Colorado (discounts = Multiple Car Discount, Auto Multiple Line Discount, Vehicle Safety Discount, Accident Free Discount)
CrazyOne
Well-Known Member
Mine went up from $1500 and year to $3000 an year, in 1 year. Othera without Rivian saw a 30% increase around here.
At $12000, I would sell rivian or go with just liability. There is no way I am paying 12k for car insurance.
At $12000, I would sell rivian or go with just liability. There is no way I am paying 12k for car insurance.
majorfriend
Well-Known Member
This is the direction I'm headed, get the minimum legally required, then self-insure. The insurance companies are setting the rates where they think they are likely to make money on you.
If they think it is a good gamble (that's what they are doing, gambling that they won't have to pay out more than you put in and doing it across a large customer base knowing they will have some wins and losses) why shouldn't I?
Keep the profits for myself instead of handing it over to someone else.
Of course, you have to be in a position where you can replace your losses if you need to. Many aren't.
Sponsored
