Yet Another Connect+ Alternative

[dfacto]

This is awesome! Have been looking for a battery-less setup myself.

if you don’t mind me asking: what was the European version of this? I am about to head to Europe next month and am looking for better band coverage for Europe.

Thanks for the thanks! It was a surprising amount of work...I won't even mention how at one point I reprogrammed the European one to try to make it work.... That was a waste of twenty hours...

The thing is they're basically all European bands (before finding these two gems that's why I was trying to reprogram... Which I'm now convinced is impossible due to hardware limitations). Anything in the twenty dollar range on Amazon is European. Look for B1 and B3 bands as likely indicators. (Your phone radio can do everything but these are very expensive and the radio alone won't exist for less than $90).

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[fxstein]

Basically all of them. Anything in the twenty dollar range on Amazon is European. Look for B1 and B3 bab bands as likely indicators

Thank you! Very much appreciated!

 

[dfacto]

Thank you! Very much appreciated!

I was afk before but here is what I first bought and which I'm now convinced can't work in America but should work in Europe:

4G LTE USB Router Modem Dongle with SIM Card Slot for Home Outdoor Travel Car, 10 Users Sharing Portable High Speed Mobile Network Card for Phone PC Tablet https://a.co/d/5u1YPNq

And here is roughly how I reprogrammed it. Later I found this which confirms it is a hardware limitation (the comments are especially useful).

In hindsight the cost was a dead giveaway. On Amazon expect to pay about 40 for USA variants and 20 for elsewhere variants; AliExpress is half that for both.

 

[dfacto]

I have a Cabin in the mountains and just use a Cudy 4G SIM router. No reason to use 5G there as it doesn't exist. TMO had a $10 add a line deal so it's a super cheap way to have internet there with external antennas. In urban areas it does 60Mbps but in the hills just 12Mbps. Enough to stream or whatever. Point is, spending more or even close to Connect+ for the Rivian would be better just to buy Connect+ -Captain Obvious.

Under your stated plan -- and assuming you buy the AliExpress version -- your savings after one year is 12($12.5-$10)-$19=$1 and $30 every year thereafter which I can see why some might not want to switch. For my typical usage on Google Fi it's 12*15-19=$131 saved for the first year and $150 saved every year thereafter. For me this crosses a threshold because I don't get much value for that $150. For me, I just don't like wasting money--even $1 saving is enough for me, assuming the time cost is negligible. (Which it is for everyone but me because I'm sharing my findings.)

Plus I don't like subscriptions I can avoid. If I own this vehicle for five more years then I'll have saved enough to pay for a flight to Hawaii and possibly some leftover for lodging--this feels like good net utility to me.

-Captain Math

 

[kong]

(probably this is known but I'll post just in case)

Goal: see if I could setup an always on Internet connection but using my existing mobile subscription rather than Connect+.

After accidentally buying a European band version, I got this and it worked great:

HOSAYA Portable WiFi 4G sim Card WiFi Modem 10 WiFi Users 4G LTE Router with SIM Card Slot High Speed Portable Travel Hotspot Mini Router USB Modem Nano sim Compact Design 88mmx28mmx9mm https://a.co/d/bGoezxt

(The trick is to look for bands B2 and B4. Having these probably means it's designed for the Americas.)

The device itself is essentially an older generation cell phone, sans screen and battery. It is powered by USB and creates a hotspot that can host up to 15 clients. It takes a nano SIM; most providers will give account holders one for free. On the topic of battery: I was specifically looking for a hotspot that doesn't have a battery because I dont need it and I don't like the idea of a battery sitting in the hot cabin. (Yes I realize the irony of the cabin sitting on 1000s of the same batteries. But keep in mind those have active cooling for a reason.)

I managed to get at most 60mbps down, depending on reception. Surprisingly the device actually has surface mount ports for antennas (2; not included). Even so I knew I wouldn't get the theoretical 150 because it doesn't support all the bands T-Mobile uses (I use Google Fi which is provided by T-Mobile).

It's $37 but there's a similar one on AliExpress for $19 which I also ordered but hasn't arrived yet: https://a.aliexpress.com/_mrrhhOj -- "U6 Global white". The AliExpress version seems like it might be better as it supports more frequency bands. And esp so for GoogleFi folks as it has more bands overlapping with T-Mobile's which should give better speeds.

After setting it up indoors, I attached an A-to-C USB adapter and plugged it in to the Rivian. Presto: an easy Internet connection that piggybacks on my existing mobile service and therefore means I don't need an additional Connect+ subscription.

Chromecast also worked flawlessly. My phone connects to the Rivian hotspot and the second Rivian wifi radio connects to the USB hotspot. Daisy chain ftw.

Let's call it "Connect-" as in "connect mine (by) us."

In the near future I'm going to see if I can build my own 5g variant, mostly just as a fun project.

Nicely done! Always good to have options.

 

[Glembi2]

(probably this is known but I'll post just in case)

Goal: see if I could setup an always on Internet connection but using my existing mobile subscription rather than Connect+.

After accidentally buying a European band version, I got this and it worked great:

HOSAYA Portable WiFi 4G sim Card WiFi Modem 10 WiFi Users 4G LTE Router with SIM Card Slot High Speed Portable Travel Hotspot Mini Router USB Modem Nano sim Compact Design 88mmx28mmx9mm https://a.co/d/bGoezxt

(The trick is to look for bands B2 and B4. Having these probably means it's designed for the Americas.)

The device itself is essentially an older generation cell phone, sans screen and battery. It is powered by USB and creates a hotspot that can host up to 15 clients. It takes a nano SIM; most providers will give account holders one for free. On the topic of battery: I was specifically looking for a hotspot that doesn't have a battery because I dont need it and I don't like the idea of a battery sitting in the hot cabin. (Yes I realize the irony of the cabin sitting on 1000s of the same batteries. But keep in mind those have active cooling for a reason.)

I managed to get at most 60mbps down, depending on reception. Surprisingly the device actually has surface mount ports for antennas (2; not included). Even so I knew I wouldn't get the theoretical 150 because it doesn't support all the bands T-Mobile uses (I use Google Fi which is provided by T-Mobile).

It's $37 but there's a similar one on AliExpress for $19 which I also ordered but hasn't arrived yet: https://a.aliexpress.com/_mrrhhOj -- "U6 Global white". The AliExpress version seems like it might be better as it supports more frequency bands. And esp so for GoogleFi folks as it has more bands overlapping with T-Mobile's which should give better speeds.

After setting it up indoors, I attached an A-to-C USB adapter and plugged it in to the Rivian. Presto: an easy Internet connection that piggybacks on my existing mobile service and therefore means I don't need an additional Connect+ subscription.

Chromecast also worked flawlessly. My phone connects to the Rivian hotspot and the second Rivian wifi radio connects to the USB hotspot. Daisy chain ftw.

Let's call it "Connect-" as in "connect mine (by) us."

In the near future I'm going to see if I can build my own 5g variant, mostly just as a fun project.

Thanks for posting the solution and how you got there.

Ya learn something new every day. I mistakenly thought the truck had only one WiFi radio that was doing double duty as either the hotspot or the access point.

 

[dfacto]

Thanks for posting the solution and how you got there.

Ya learn something new every day. I mistakenly thought the truck had only one WiFi radio that was doing double duty as either the hotspot or the access point.

Me too! I wasn't originally sure this would work but then I realized that I can connect to Rivian hotspot while the Rivian is connected to my home Wi-Fi.

In hindsight what Rivian did is pretty nice. Having two Wi-Fi radios (one for hot and one for wan) means Daisy chaining is easy. Come to think of it, I'm not totally sure Daisy chaining is even necessary to be able to cast. I'll try connecting both phone and Rivian to the USB hotspot and report back after breakfast!

 

[usofrob]

Under your stated plan -- and assuming you buy the AliExpress version -- your savings after one year is 12($12.5-$10)-$19=$1 and $30 every year thereafter which I agree isn't much. For my typical usage on Google Fi it's 12*15-19=$131 saved for the first year and $150 saved every year thereafter. For me this crosses a threshold because I don't get much value for that $150. (I can clearly afford it. I just don't like wasting money, even $1 is enough for me.) Plus I don't like subscriptions I can avoid.

-Captain Math

The HW solution is interesting. But I don't understand how you're saving money. What Google Fi plan are you paying for?

$149.99 per year to get unlimited data from Rivian seems like a pretty good deal.

I've got the cheapest Mint Mobile plan at $15/month for 5GB. I had Google Fi, but this is cheaper for my typical 1-2GB per month usage. I wonder how much data the Rivian would use for general driving. I could enable my hotspot all the time, but so far I just use my phone when needing to stream music and Rivian is still letting me do the Youtube Cast thing. When they stop that, I'll just share from my phone for the few times we need it.

 

[dfacto]

The HW solution is interesting. But I don't understand how you're saving money. What Google Fi plan are you paying for?

$149.99 per year to get unlimited data from Rivian seems like a pretty good deal.

I've got the cheapest Mint Mobile plan at $15/month for 5GB. I had Google Fi, but this is cheaper for my typical 1-2GB per month usage. I wonder how much data the Rivian would use for general driving. I could enable my hotspot all the time, but so far I just use my phone when needing to stream music and Rivian is still letting me do the Youtube Cast thing. When they stop that, I'll just share from my phone for the few times we need it.

I currently have the flexible plan. I thought I was paying in gigabyte chunks but after just looking at the details now I'm not sure. My Office Space thinking was that I can let the Rivian eat up the rest of the unused gb.

Maybe I should switch to mint like you. How is it? Does data get throttled even when under your cap? (Last time I checked Reddit some folks said it was lower priority than other providers.) Does it support Wi-Fi calling?

I do like Fi's convenience for international travel though...

 

[fxstein]

I was afk before but here is what I first bought and which I'm now convinced can't work in America but should work in Europe:

4G LTE USB Router Modem Dongle with SIM Card Slot for Home Outdoor Travel Car, 10 Users Sharing Portable High Speed Mobile Network Card for Phone PC Tablet https://a.co/d/5u1YPNq

And here is roughly how I reprogrammed it. Later I found this which confirms it is a hardware limitation (the comments are especially useful).

In hindsight the cost was a dead giveaway. On Amazon expect to pay about 40 for USA variants and 20 for elsewhere variants; AliExpress is half that for both.

Again thank you for all the details. Given it’s so cheap I might just get one in any case.

I have been doing some more research myself and being a longtime Ubiquity customer they offer an interesting device as well:

US Version
https://store.ui.com/us/en/products/umr-ultra-us
EU Version
https://eu.store.ui.com/eu/en/category/mobile-routing/products/umr-ultra-eu

The European version supports all the right bands for 3G and 4G LTE.

A bit more expensive at €95 but with detachable LTE and WiFi Antennas and I can manage remotely through my UniFi account.
There is also a US version in the US store but it does not list B1 and B3 - everything else seems identical.

 

[fxstein]

Can't I just run the mobile hotspot on my 5G phone ?

Absolutely can BUT a few things that will get in the way for some:

1. When you leave the car e.g. during a charging session you will most likely take your phone with you. That means you wont see the charging updates or any related alerts.
2. On a road trip while staying at a random hotel you wont have access to any of the vehicle functions or update - just like during charging.
3. More than 1 driver means you will have to switch mobile phone hotspots - you might get around that if you set them up with identical SSID and password and the proper automation to enable them any time you enter the vehicle - have never tried that.

Can't wait to try this out this week myself.

 

[usofrob]

Maybe I should switch to mint like you. How is it? Does data get throttled even when under your cap? (Last time I checked Reddit some folks said it was lower priority than other providers.) Does it support Wi-Fi calling?

I do like Fi's convenience for international travel though...

Mint Mobile is fine. I suspect my data is deprioritized. But, I don't tend to use much data when I'm out. And, it's never been a problem.

Some years ago when I had Fi, it was very nice when travelling in Japan. I didn't need to get local service. It was also nice when it could access via T-Mobile or the other one, but now T-Mobile bought the other one.

 

[PBRAZ]

Very cool, thanks for sharing.

FWIW, AT&T and T-Mobile's main 5G frequencies are low and mid band, which are not strictly line of sight. You are getting 5G signals indoors, right? Still, 4G is plenty fast, reliable, and ubiquitous.

Also, those that use their phone as a hotspot and have at least a 20 to 30 minute commute to to work each way are blowing through more than 1 GB per month. Average steaming rate is between 100 and 300kbps for apps like Spotify and Amazon Music, and 1Mbps+ for apps like Apple Music and Tidal. For context, 300kbps is about 7 hours of music per 1GB of data.

 

[dfacto]

Very cool, thanks for sharing.

FWIW, AT&T and T-Mobile's main 5G frequencies are low and mid band, which are not strictly line of sight. You are getting 5G signals indoors, right? Still, 4G is plenty fast, reliable, and ubiquitous.

Also, those that use their phone as a hotspot and have at least a 20 to 30 minute commute to to work each way are blowing through more than 1 GB per month. Average steaming rate is between 100 and 300kbps for apps like Spotify and Amazon Music, and 1Mbps+ for apps like Apple Music and Tidal. For context, 300kbps is about 7 hours of music per 1GB of data.

It's a complex beast. On some level, all emag is line of sight. But the words "line" and "sight" are nuanced. Ignoring reflection, the "line" is more like a tube whose diameter is related to wavelength and sight is related to material attenuation. And 5g is itself really more like the protocol, akin to wifi6.

So a more precise statement I could have used is this: "to get the fast speeds which would make a typical 5g radio potentially have appreciable utility over a 4g radio would man the carrier would either have to allocate their high frequency bands or allocate a larger amount of their low frequency bands. But most carriers choose not to do the former in regions of low population, the likes of which you might find yourself when on a road trip". They choose not to do the former because high frequencies are attenuated by vegetation and would need more towers than would be cost effective. And they generally can't allocate sufficiently many low frequencies to obtain high speeds because they don't own that much bandwidth.

So from a users perspective 5g ends up giving about the same download speeds as 4g unless you live in a region densely populated enough to make higher frequency deployment cost effective.

The elephant in the room is throttling. On C+ I get 23mbps but on my setup I get 60mpbs with lower latency. This does make a noticeable difference in the UI.

You make a good point about Spotify though. I commute 200min/wk which is 3.75gb. I hadn't considered this because I listen to cached playlists but I doubt the Rivian Spotify caches, sadly.

 

[HaveBlue]

Absolutely can BUT a few things that will get in the way for some:

1. When you leave the car e.g. during a charging session you will most likely take your phone with you. That means you wont see the charging updates or any related alerts.
2. On a road trip while staying at a random hotel you wont have access to any of the vehicle functions or update - just like during charging.
3. More than 1 driver means you will have to switch mobile phone hotspots - you might get around that if you set them up with identical SSID and password and the proper automation to enable them any time you enter the vehicle - have never tried that.

Can't wait to try this out this week myself.

Wouldn't the car just default to the free data connection for this?

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