Comma AI / OpenPilot Autopilot Progress on R1!

[risingphoenix]

That’s why I wrote this in initial question, with emphasis added now:

It doesn’t matter what driving model the comma is in. The Rivian still thinks it’s in TACC. At least in current implementation. Now if you enabled the comma manually without using the stalk (not currently possible) then your options would be greater.

Edit: It seems you misunderstand how the comma works. It is a "man in the middle", which means for it to function, it has to utilize the same AXM and system controls that TACC uses to control the car. So it is impossible for the comma to function without the Rivian being in TACC. I don't think what you are asking for (suspension control) is possible without significant changes to the Rivian software that would have to occur on Rivian's side.

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[SoCal Rob]

It doesn’t matter what driving model the comma is in. The Rivian still thinks it’s in TACC. At least in current implementation. Now if you enabled the comma manually without using the stalk (not currently possible) then your options would be greater.

Edit: It seems you misunderstand how the comma works. It is a "man in the middle", which means for it to function, it has to utilize the same AXM and system controls that TACC uses to control the car. So it is impossible for the comma to function without the Rivian being in TACC. I don't think what you are asking for (suspension control) is possible without significant changes to the Rivian software that would have to occur on Rivian's side.

Maybe I’m not writing clearly so I’m going to try wording this in a different way.

This is my understanding as someone who owns and drives a Gen1 Rivian but neither owns nor has experience with a Comma AI unit:

1. As of today, the Rivian ACC prevents changing items on the drive modes screen. (e.g. ride comfort from soft to moderate) This is true when ACC is engaged simply as adaptive cruise control or as Highway Assist, which relies on ACC.

2. As of today, the Comma AI using OpenPilot relies on the Rivian ACC for longitudinal control. In my mind. this is effectively a hybrid setup where the Comma controls steering and the Rivian’s ACC controls speed.

3. There is ongoing work to allow the Comma to take over longitudinal control so in the (near?) future it will be only the Comma unit controlling both direction and speed. Once this is accomplished, my understanding is Rivian’s ACC will not be used at all.

I would appreciate feedback if I am misunderstanding the current setup as I wrote in 1 & 2 and/or what is being planned in 3.

My question is:

Once we have gotten to the point that the Comma unit is not using Rivian’s ACC (3, above), will it be possible to make changes which are forbidden when the native ACC is engaged?

 

[JM.]

Once we have gotten to the point that the Comma unit is not using Rivian’s ACC (3, above), will it be possible to make changes which are forbidden when the native ACC is engaged?

There are two people who probably can answer this. @CTRedCanyon is probably one of them.

The fix for longitudinal control has been announced and will deliver in about a month. There's another thread about this. *IF* I understand it correctly, the answer to your question is yes, because it appears that it does the control and disables TACC. I am not a Comma insider, I'm a hardware/software nerd leveraging what I know about the system to construct a logical conclusion without specifically knowing it.

 

[risingphoenix]

Maybe I’m not writing clearly so I’m going to try wording this in a different way.

This is my understanding as someone who owns and drives a Gen1 Rivian but neither owns nor has experience with a Comma AI unit:

1. As of today, the Rivian ACC prevents changing items on the drive modes screen. (e.g. ride comfort from soft to moderate) This is true when ACC is engaged simply as adaptive cruise control or as Highway Assist, which relies on ACC.

2. As of today, the Comma AI using OpenPilot relies on the Rivian ACC for longitudinal control. In my mind. this is effectively a hybrid setup where the Comma controls steering and the Rivian’s ACC controls speed.

3. There is ongoing work to allow the Comma to take over longitudinal control so in the (near?) future it will be only the Comma unit controlling both direction and speed. Once this is accomplished, my understanding is Rivian’s ACC will not be used at all.

I would appreciate feedback if I am misunderstanding the current setup as I wrote in 1 & 2 and/or what is being planned in 3.

My question is:

Once we have gotten to the point that the Comma unit is not using Rivian’s ACC (3, above), will it be possible to make changes which are forbidden when the native ACC is engaged?

While it may be possible for the comma unit to function without engaging ACC (ie engaging the comma manually), I don't think that is ever the goal of Open Pilot. I know of no other vehicle that comma works with that does not engage the ACC in the native vehicle way. I am currently on the bleeding edge forks of comma and Rivian and I don't think what you are asking will ever happen because I doubt the developers would want to do that. Obviously I don't speak for them. But in answer to your question, I am currently on a fork that does not utilize Rivian's ACC and those changes are still not allowed because the Rivian still "thinks" it's in ACC.

Edit: The above is likely wrong because the comma already controls steering with MADS (without controlling speed). So it is already working (but not fully) without having ACC engaged.

 

[JM.]

While it may be possible for the comma unit to function without engaging ACC (ie engaging the comma manually), I don't think that is ever the goal of Open Pilot. I know of no other vehicle that comma works with that does not engage the ACC in the native vehicle way. I am currently on the bleeding edge forks of comma and Rivian and I don't think what you are asking will ever happen because I doubt the developers would want to do that. Obviously I don't speak for them. But in answer to your question, I am currently on a fork that does not utilize Rivian's ACC and those changes are still not allowed because the Rivian still "thinks" it's in ACC.

The reason I think you MAY be wrong (not arguing really) is that the fix for the Rivian has its own box and processor.

 

[risingphoenix]

The reason I think you MAY be wrong (not arguing really) is that the fix for the Rivian has its own box and processor.

Okay here's what we can do TODAY. MADS is a capability in a fork of Open Pilot (Sunnypilot) that uncouples steering control from speed, which disengages ACC. So you can currently maintain steering control temporarily by engaging MADS (pull up on stalk once) while keeping your foot on the accelerator and change anything in the suspension or mode and then reengage ACC after a change (pull down on stalk once). I just confirmed that this works.

 

[risingphoenix]

The reason I think you MAY be wrong (not arguing really) is that the fix for the Rivian has its own box and processor.

No the fix that Lukas has discovered is another CAN interface. It's still intercepting signal and just being a man in the middle. And the changes today might make even that unnecessary.

 

[rhumbliner]

No the fix that Lukas has discovered is another CAN interface. It's still intercepting signal and just being a man in the middle. And the changes today might make even that unnecessary.

I recently added the Comma 3X wiring harness to my R1T and downloaded the stable version of OpenPilot and I believe my question is in line with this discussion.

When towing a trailer Rivian still requires manual braking while in ACC. This behavior is the same with OpenPilot. Is there any chance OpenPilot will be able to override this behavior? Is this the longitudinal control referenced in this discussion?

 

[godfodder0901]

No the fix that Lukas has discovered is another CAN interface. It's still intercepting signal and just being a man in the middle. And the changes today might make even that unnecessary.

Is there a site we can read about this, or is it all on Discord?

 

[risingphoenix]

Is there a site we can read about this, or is it all on Discord?

Discord.

Which is like looking for bitcoin in a garage dump.

The comma->Rivian project just became possible a few weeks ago. The changes and advancements are happening at breakneck speed. But even with no additional improvements it's a much better ADAS than Driver+ in Gen 1 (and I would argue Gen2 as well) vehicles. If you are a tinkerer I highly recommend it. If you want a stable mature product I would think it will be an awesome addition in 1-2 months.

 

[godfodder0901]

Discord.

Which is like looking for bitcoin in a garage dump.

The comma->Rivian project just became possible a few weeks ago. The changes and advancements are happening at breakneck speed. But even with no additional improvements it's a much better ADAS than Driver+ in Gen 1 (and I would argue Gen2 as well) vehicles. If you are a tinkerer I highly recommend it. If you want a stable mature product I would think it will be an awesome addition in 1-2 months.

My primary reason for waiting was the longitudinal piece. Now that I have a reasonable confidence in its availability, I'll pull the trigger.

That said, it doesn't seem like the add-on box idea lasted very long, and a new CAN interface was mentioned. Do we know if that will require a new harness?

 

[Tatnai]

Discord.

Which is like looking for bitcoin in a garage dump.

The comma->Rivian project just became possible a few weeks ago. The changes and advancements are happening at breakneck speed. But even with no additional improvements it's a much better ADAS than Driver+ in Gen 1 (and I would argue Gen2 as well) vehicles. If you are a tinkerer I highly recommend it. If you want a stable mature product I would think it will be an awesome addition in 1-2 months.

Aside: love the bitcoin in a garbage dump reference, been following that story for a while now, it is so delicious.

 

[risingphoenix]

I recently added the Comma 3X wiring harness to my R1T and downloaded the stable version of OpenPilot and I believe my question is in line with this discussion.

When towing a trailer Rivian still requires manual braking while in ACC. This behavior is the same with OpenPilot. Is there any chance OpenPilot will be able to override this behavior? Is this the longitudinal control referenced in this discussion?

@Tarkus could answer this question. Not sure if he has tested Lukas's latest longitudinal control to test with a trailer.

My primary reason for waiting was the longitudinal piece. Now that I have a reasonable confidence in its availability, I'll pull the trigger.

That said, it doesn't seem like the add-on box idea lasted very long, and a new CAN interface was mentioned. Do we know if that will require a new harness?

add on box will still happen I think but will still require same harness per Lukas

 

[sacramentoelectric]

My primary reason for waiting was the longitudinal piece. Now that I have a reasonable confidence in its availability, I'll pull the trigger.

That said, it doesn't seem like the add-on box idea lasted very long, and a new CAN interface was mentioned. Do we know if that will require a new harness?

From my discussions with Lukas, my understanding is that an add on box is required for longitudinal control. The existing harness can only access two signal busses at once but the set speed signals are on a third bus. This isn't typical and is the reason an extra piece of hardware will be required.

 

[risingphoenix]

From my discussions with Lukas, my understanding is that an add on box is required for longitudinal control. The existing harness can only access two signal busses at once but the set speed signals are on a third bus. This isn't typical and is the reason an extra piece of hardware will be required.

we have longitudinal control today per Lukas new fork. Just not set speed via right steering wheel clicks.

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