Electrify America to Add NACS Connector by 2025, While Continuing CCS Support

[Dark-Fx]

Sweet, free camping spots.

Charging to 100% every time I use a SC.

Why else would I have my RTT ladder come down on the driver's side?

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[Dark-Fx]

If we're really being honest is charging all that great right now?

It's 100% viable non-Tesla everywhere I go. Last year in the late winter we drove across West Virginia, which is one of the places stated as being a problem for EVs.

I avoid traveling during holidays just as I would if I were getting on a plane.

Only time I have been stranded since buying my Bolt EV in 2018 was in my Camaro convertible overnight because there was no-one to man the gas station over night and they need to be by law in my state. Ironically enough, there was an unoccupied Tesla destination charger in that same lot which would have meant being able to depart about 4 hours earlier in my Bolt versus waiting for the gas station to re-open.

 

[CrazyOne]

Superchargers are not going anywhere. I want EA to exist. Without EA and IRA, Tesla would not open up their network to everyone. So I would use EA when ever I can and use SC as backup.

 

[anagnorisis]

I would want EA to exist as well. Electricity is the same regardless of vendor. What we are concerned with is how it plugs in and reliability. Having both connectors means all that EA has to work on is reliability. Surely this can't be that hard....

 

[Longreach]

If only I had experience on my own using EA and was able to form my own opinion.

You CAN form your own opinion! And it might be good for your case today.

But there is plenty of bad EA experience evidence out there. So you might be better off in the long run if EA assets were sold to a network operator with the primary objective of running a good charging network rather than just spending government fine money.

 

[WSea]

You CAN form your own opinion! And it might be good for your case today.

But there is plenty of bad EA experience evidence out there. So you might be better off in the long run if EA assets were sold to a network operator with the primary objective of running a good charging network rather than just spending government fine money.

Don’t believe EA has received any monies from the government. Siemens did inject 400mil+ as a minor shareholder.

 

[Longreach]

Don’t believe EA has received any monies from the government. Siemens did inject 400mil+ as a minor shareholder.

EA only exists because of VW dieselgate. Its creation was effectively a government negotiated fine imposed on VW, even though the money didn’t go through the government.

Stripping it down to the basics, VW was obligated to hand over the money to the new entity EA who was obligated to spend it on as many chargers as possible. It was a mandated capital deployment plan and plenty of suppliers stepped in to take the money for up front construction. Operations and maintenance wasn’t really part of that process, and it shows.

At this point, EA doesn’t seem to have the scale, mandate or interest in operating a reliable network, so the best outcome for everyone would be an asset sale to someone who does want to operate a network.

 

[CrazyOne]

You CAN form your own opinion! And it might be good for your case today.

But there is plenty of bad EA experience evidence out there. So you might be better off in the long run if EA assets were sold to a network operator with the primary objective of running a good charging network rather than just spending government fine money.

Afaik, the only major network built with government money is the Tesla network.

 

[Autolycus]

Yes EA started as a diesel gate punishment but it's now an actual company that is trying to make a profit. It's not run by VW (even though VW does have investment in it).

it can’t and it won’t be only Tesla chargers. That’s a monopoly and not allowed in the US.

Technically monopolies are allowed so long as they don't behave anti-competitively or are a public utility that is granted special license to operate as a monopoly. The problem with a monopolistic Tesla supercharging network is that it wouldn't just be a monopolistic charging network, it would also be very likely to exhibit anti-competitive behavior with respect to vehicle manufacture and sales (i.e. Tesla could easily provide unfair advantages to Tesla vehicles).

 

[Dark-Fx]

Afaik, the only major network built with government money is the Tesla network.

A significant portion of the Chargepoint stations in Michigan exist because of government grants. Lots more of these types of installs coming.

https://www.michigan.gov/-/media/Pr...geUp.pdf?rev=66c455bcef214f52b18d19a0739b7664

But if you read about where the funding came from...

F. Funding Source and Grant Amounts
A total of $9,721,052 is available for DCFC EV charging station grants. Grant funds shall be distributed in two phases over the next three years, with EGLE reserving the right to accelerate or decelerate grant amounts within that time frame, depending upon the number of applications, application receipt timing, and other considerations. Within Phase I, EGLE will distribute 80 percent ($7,776,842) to Direct Current Fast Charging (DCFC) infrastructure as outlined in the Electric Vehicle Charger Placement Optimization in Michigan: Phase I – Highways and Tourism report and 20 percent ($1,944,210) toward DCFC and Level 2 charging infrastructure projects in Phase II. The grant time period may also be extended based upon any currently unforeseen circumstances. Grants will be provided to eligible entities partnering with a Michigan electric utility generator and will be funded with dollars allocated to Michigan via the State Mitigation Trust in accordance with requirements in the Environmental Mitigation Trust Agreement for State Beneficiaries and the Michigan Volkswagen Settlement Beneficiary Mitigation Plan.

 

[Dukecj]

VW group including all of their brands will most likely join NACS based on their statement:

"Volkswagen Group and its brands are currently evaluating the implementation of the Tesla North American Charging Standard (NACS) for its North American customers."

https://electrek.co/2023/06/29/volkswagen-talks-tesla-adopt-nacs-connector/

That is corporate speak for "keep buying our CCS cars and we will continue to evaluate the implementation of the Tesla North American Charging Standard (NACS) for our North American customers until wireless charging starts this fight all over again in 10 years.

 

[Autolycus]

That is corporate speak for "keep buying our CCS cars and we will continue to evaluate the implementation of the Tesla North American Charging Standard (NACS) for our North American customers until wireless charging starts this fight all over again in 10 years.

There's going to have to be some miracle technology for wireless charging to ever make sense. Transmission loss on a phone-size battery is not good, but it's still a pretty small amount of total loss. On cars? Oh boy! The transmission loss just from wired charging is already at the limits of what we should be ok with.

 

[MDH]

That's funny. I see Tesla's charging on EA all the time even with SC slots available nearby (sometimes in the same parking lot).

I for one will use the most economical charger that delivers a reasonable charging speed.

I for one will use the most convenient charger that delivers a reasonable charging speed. Going out of my way to save a few bucks on the occasional road trip makes no sense to me.

 

[evguy]

I actually am going to "Teslagate" at Supercharger stations with no interest in charging - only for spectating on what is going to be an inevitable complete and total shit show.

Anyone want to join me - grab a cold one pull up to the grill....

Whatever do you mean??? I'm sure Tesla owners will calmly accept the explanations from Rivian/GM/Ford, etc. owners about why it's necessary for them to occupy two stalls in order to connect . . .

 

[MDH]

Screw that.

I'm not paying any money to Tesla.

EA does have problems, but only once in five years of EV ownership have I truly been unable to charge at an EA station. Individual stalls being down is annoying, but it's not like EA is an absolute garbage fire that leaves people stranded constantly. And it's still the biggest network of CCS stations. They aren't going away the instant vehicles start shipping with NACS.

Hell, EVgo is still around, and they had far worse problems than EA right when EA was expanding and before EA was having problems.

Glad you feel that way. Wish there were more that don't like Elon/Tesla. SCs are gonna get very crowded.

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