Snow Mode fail - costly result

[Ape Latex]

7000 lbs...downhill. Might be better with snow socks or winter tires but 7000 lbs ..

Yeah, maybe that's just the issue.

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[Zorg]

I have had a similar experience to OP in snow. I'm using Nokian Outpost nAT tires. The uphill traction is really good so I don't get stuck, but for some reason the downhill traction while braking is much worse. I'm not sure if it's from the regen locking up some wheels while going downhill, but the truck can be scary to drive going downhill in the snow.

Have you tried using Regen downhill? We stopped braking in the snow/ice and just use snow mode Regen to come to a stop. Much better.

 

[godfodder0901]

Have you tried using Regen downhill? We stopped braking in the snow/ice and just use snow mode Regen to come to a stop. Much better.

Hard disagree. You can't use just brakes, and the regen doesn't allow for ABS. Terrible combo.

 

[Zorg]

Hard disagree. You can't use just brakes, and the regen doesn't allow for ABS. Terrible combo.

That may be true but I found out that Regen will bring me to a stop safely on snow and ice, whereas brakes lock up too easily and truck just slides. Or maybe my abs doesn't work. Either way now Regen is well calibrated with decent tires.

 

[MountainBikeDude]

I have had a similar experience to OP in snow. I'm using Nokian Outpost nAT tires. The uphill traction is really good so I don't get stuck, but for some reason the downhill traction while braking is much worse. I'm not sure if it's from the regen locking up some wheels while going downhill, but the truck can be scary to drive going downhill in the snow.

I would partially agree. Same tires and as you said, the truck is a beast with them going up hills. Downhill, Maybe I've been fortunate, but I haven't found the truck to be unwieldy when I'm trying to decelerate/come to a stop, but I haven't had too many on road, hard packed ice/black ice instances to compare notes.

What I have found, is if the truck starts to lock up, feathering the throttle will correct it, and because of the front power bias in snow mode, will typically steer the truck in the direction of the wheels.

 

[Ape Latex]

I would partially agree. Same tires and as you said, the truck is a beast with them going up hills. Downhill, Maybe I've been fortunate, but I haven't found the truck to be unwieldy when I'm trying to decelerate/come to a stop, but I haven't had too many on road, hard packed ice/black ice instances to compare notes.

What I have found, is if the truck starts to lock up, feathering the throttle will correct it, and because of the front power bias in snow mode, will typically steer the truck in the direction of the wheels.

Good to know. The ABS works well when the mechanical brakes are engaged. But when I'm only using regen to slow down, the truck often slides sideways, possibly due to lock up. I wish they would let us turn regen off. Then we would know for sure. This does seem like a safety issue.

 

[zefram47]

I find that my R1S is relatively terrible in the snow, compared to my previous Audi and BMWs with winter tires. I was attributing that to the tires- I have the 20" All-Terrain tires that came with the R1S, and have put off getting actual winter tires since we’re in yet another minimal snow winter here in Minnesota (unfortunately!!).
Do others think the slipperiness in the snow is mostly due to regen brakes or the tires? Now that I think about it, the car seems to slip more when I’m slowing down versus driving at a steady speed or speeding up, which would argue that it’s more of a regen brake issue than a tire issue. I’m sure winter tires would help regardless.

100% tires. I'm on my second season with Blizzak LT and in snow mode I have yet to see the regen lockup the wheels even in high regen, though I haven't experienced ice yet. It's a 7000 lbs truck and the nannies will only get you so far...tires will always be the most important thing.

Snow mode is about useless, as I dont notice a difference in-between the All-Purpose mode, and snow, no matter the regen setting.

I am hoping to burn out these craptastic 22" Pirelli's this year, and switch over to Michelin or Continental.

As above, tires make all the difference. It's a 7000 lbs truck and tires are the only defense against physics. I've been running Blizzak LT and they've been great. I have noticed a difference in the behavior of regen between all-purpose and snow modes, with snow mode preventing lockup even on high regen much better than AP. If you've had a traditional 4x4 (not AWD) in the past, you have inertia in the driveline that actively prevents lockup at any one wheel before hitting the brakes which is part of the reason why downshifting made a big difference in control. The Rivian Quad motor system is almost the opposite of that since none of the wheels are connected and each motor is totally independent, so it's inherently easier to get lockup. The problem comes in when all four lock and the vehicle is still moving (sliding)...at that point you'll never get ABS because no wheels are turning.

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We need Regen off on all modes. Even off road mode. Descending steep rutted hills, the car will lurch forward in free fall when one wheel loses traction. You can't use the brakes because the vehicle would just stop entirely. Having to put it in neutral for no Regen is pretty stupid. It's the only way to apply braking to all wheels.

Last weekend I went 4 wheeling in the rocks and snow. The Rivian stayed at home and we took the Lexus.

Keep in mind that the newer duals and tri's are front wheel drive in All purpose. Driving in mountain roads with only the front wheels braking sucks bad.

Tow mode and all other modes force AWD so you get 4wheel regen.

A regular car you can instantly get to neutral beyond even engine braking with a clutch or shifter. The Rivian has a stupid plastic stick that doesn't shift into neutral until it's too late.

Here's a video where you can see the Rivian start to run away under Regen even in AWD mode. You get either brakes (stop) or gas/regen with runaway. Modulating in between is tough as regen comes in and out randomly. On a steeper hill it would go out of control.

For off-road downhill situations with dips/rocks, use rock crawl mode and turn off the brake hold. The brake hold is what's actually causing your issues. If you turn that off then you can use regen or friction brakes as necessary and get smooth descents. Why they don't let you turn off brake hold in other off-road modes I don't know. Just remember to turn it back on again or you'll be in for a surprise on the next ascent.

 

[HaveBlue]

100% tires. I'm on my second season with Blizzak LT and in snow mode I have yet to see the regen lockup the wheels even in high regen, though I haven't experienced ice yet. It's a 7000 lbs truck and the nannies will only get you so far...tires will always be the most important thing.



As above, tires make all the difference. It's a 7000 lbs truck and tires are the only defense against physics. I've been running Blizzak LT and they've been great. I have noticed a difference in the behavior of regen between all-purpose and snow modes, with snow mode preventing lockup even on high regen much better than AP. If you've had a traditional 4x4 (not AWD) in the past, you have inertia in the driveline that actively prevents lockup at any one wheel before hitting the brakes which is part of the reason why downshifting made a big difference in control. The Rivian Quad motor system is almost the opposite of that since none of the wheels are connected and each motor is totally independent, so it's inherently easier to get lockup. The problem comes in when all four lock and the vehicle is still moving (sliding)...at that point you'll never get ABS because no wheels are turning.

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For off-road downhill situations with dips/rocks, use rock crawl mode and turn off the brake hold. The brake hold is what's actually causing your issues. If you turn that off then you can use regen or friction brakes as necessary and get smooth descents. Why they don't let you turn off brake hold in other off-road modes I don't know. Just remember to turn it back on again or you'll be in for a surprise on the next ascent.

Thanks for the tip! I'll check and see if I have that option somewhere.

 

[zefram47]

Thanks for the tip! I'll check and see if I have that option somewhere.

I just saw you have a dual-motor in your profile. IIRC, you only have one off-road mode? It's possible they don't allow you to turn the brake hold off, but that would be really unfortunate, On the quad we get a bunch of different off-road modes, one being rock crawl.

 

[Seano]

I have had a similar experience to OP in snow. I'm using Nokian Outpost nAT tires. The uphill traction is really good so I don't get stuck, but for some reason the downhill traction while braking is much worse. I'm not sure if it's from the regen locking up some wheels while going downhill, but the truck can be scary to drive going downhill in the snow.

I’ve got the outposts on a Jeep Wangler (manual trans) and they really don’t stand up to snows as I hoped they would: Rivian with Haka 5s (even at the heavy weight) much more capable in my experience.

 

[Ape Latex]

100% tires. I'm on my second season with Blizzak LT and in snow mode I have yet to see the regen lockup the wheels even in high regen, though I haven't experienced ice yet. It's a 7000 lbs truck and the nannies will only get you so far...tires will always be the most important thing.



As above, tires make all the difference. It's a 7000 lbs truck and tires are the only defense against physics. I've been running Blizzak LT and they've been great. I have noticed a difference in the behavior of regen between all-purpose and snow modes, with snow mode preventing lockup even on high regen much better than AP. If you've had a traditional 4x4 (not AWD) in the past, you have inertia in the driveline that actively prevents lockup at any one wheel before hitting the brakes which is part of the reason why downshifting made a big difference in control. The Rivian Quad motor system is almost the opposite of that since none of the wheels are connected and each motor is totally independent, so it's inherently easier to get lockup. The problem comes in when all four lock and the vehicle is still moving (sliding)...at that point you'll never get ABS because no wheels are turning.

===================================================================





For off-road downhill situations with dips/rocks, use rock crawl mode and turn off the brake hold. The brake hold is what's actually causing your issues. If you turn that off then you can use regen or friction brakes as necessary and get smooth descents. Why they don't let you turn off brake hold in other off-road modes I don't know. Just remember to turn it back on again or you'll be in for a surprise on the next ascent.

I'll try the rock crawl mode next time. Perhaps that will help. Thanks for the info.

 

[Ape Latex]

I’ve got the outposts on a Jeep Wangler (manual trans) and they really don’t stand up to snows as I hoped they would: Rivian with Haka 5s (even at the heavy weight) much more capable in my experience.

Got it. Of course real snow tires will make the biggest difference. 95% of my driving is in warm SoCal weather with occasional light or deep snow in the mountains, so dedicated snow tires on my truck don't make sense for me.

 

[Seano]

Got it. Of course real snow tires will make the biggest difference. 95% of my driving is in warm SoCal weather with occasional light or deep snow in the mountains, so dedicated snow tires on my truck don't make sense for me.

Completely understand! Sort of the same issue with my Jeep (occasional snow use). I wanted an AT tire that was at least snow capable - can’t compare the Faulkens etc bc the only thing I’ve run on the jeeps prev is MTRs

 

[HaveBlue]

I just saw you have a dual-motor in your profile. IIRC, you only have one off-road mode? It's possible they don't allow you to turn the brake hold off, but that would be really unfortunate, On the quad we get a bunch of different off-road modes, one being rock crawl.

Offroad and sand mode

 

[tragicmonkey049]

NOKIAN HAKKAPELIITTA R5 SUV 275/60-20

Sold! Ready to bolt on when winter arrives.

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