Tesla Supercharger access went live!... temporarily

[Stepan]

Since plug and charge from Tesla to non-Tesla uses the standardized protocol that EA also uses, does that mean that we can now plug and charge at EA as well?

In order for Plug & Charge (ISO 15118-2) to work, 4 entities have to implement their side of it.

1. OEM (Rivian)
2. Charge Point Operator (Tesla/EA/RAN)
3. Mobility Operator (Rivian, Blue Oval Network, etc)
4. Certificate "warehouse" (Rivian, Hubject, etc)

EA and Mobility Operator (In our case, Rivian) and certificate warehouse all have to set themselves up to be able to integrate with each other. And while the communcation between the charger and the car is well defined, setting up billing, communicating progress, charger status, etc, between charge point operator and mobility operator is a lot less standardized, with several competing specifications. Given tesla's track record, they probably are also not using any of them, so its not very transferrable to EA.

There are several factors that are all working against P&C happening on EA anytime soon:

1. [For customers] all charging memberships (EA Pass+, Tesla Supercharger Membership) are invalid, as those systems today are completely separate, via Rivian you will always be paying prenegotiated prices (most likely full price). Since these memberships pay for themselves after 2-3 charges, p&c is completely useless to anyone using it with any amount of frequency.
2. [For customers] At least in case of Ford, charge credit cards (Think Cosco's 4% cash back for "fuel ups") do not correctly classify those purchases as fuel ups. I've never been billed by Rivian for charging, but same issue could exist here.
3. [For Rivian] Rivian is busy trying to hit their own commitment of opening up RAN in 2024, which means same people that would be working with EA to integrate are busy ensuring seamless first party experience. As more evidence of this, all of EA's chargers are listed at 150kwh in the nav/app and have been for years. This tells me Rivian isn't prioritizing EA at all.
4. [For EA] Their software is a mess. Their own app and chargers do not know when they're working or not, let alone allowing 3rd parties visibility is extremely restrictive. Their first party vehicle (I.D. 4) only got recently enabled, only for the latest model year and it crashed systems for both EA and VW. If I was in charge of that software team, Rivian P&C would be very low on my priority list.

AFAIK, Tesla Superchargers uniquely added a pre-check to control OEM access to their network. Once an OEM implements full p&c (as per terms with Tesla), and the car can talk full 15118 protocol, has the right certificates to authorize communication (requires OTA) with the superchargers, you can use the tesla app to initiate charge and transact (be billed) for it. This is why people can already charge their Rivians as 2024.07 update installed the certificates and by initiating charge in the tesla app, the handshake goes through.

Depending on your technical level, this could be useful:
https://www.switch-ev.com/blog/basics-of-plug-and-charge

I should add there is another "simpler" option that EV Go and EVConnect does, called Autocharge and sometimes confusingly Plug and Charge. Autocharge only uses a "mac address" aka a unique identifier for each car. The charging network uses the car's MAC address, and "remembers" it to automate future sessions. Tesla and EA do not use that all (besides, maybe, internal tracking).

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[DrewT]

Installed 2024.07.03 last night without issue and today launched Tesla app at home (in Canada) and when I went to charge my vehicle was allowed oto input Rivian -have not seen that before .-maybe it's a magic dock thing but we don't have them here except Calgary

 

[ndmiller]

That'sgood enough for me. I just put in a order for an A2Z adapter.

Why? Rivian is sending you one for free?

 

[Cosmacelf]

Why? Rivian is sending you one for free?

Because if Ford is any indication, it can be many months before you get the free adapter.

 

[Jiji]

Installed 2024.07.03 last night without issue and today launched Tesla app at home (in Canada) and when I went to charge my vehicle was allowed oto input Rivian -have not seen that before .-maybe it's a magic dock thing but we don't have them here except Calgary

I have a Mach-E in the Tesla app and it shows a local NACS location. The Tesla app lets you add multiple vehicles and when I add my Rivian to the Tesla app (with my Mach-E or by itself), the local NACS location disappears from the Find a Charger list, seems like a Tesla app but to me.

Also the NACS site details on the Tesla app still only shows Ford so I think we need to be patient and wait for everything to fall in place. Of course at a MagicDock site all EVs can charge, no matter what you enter in the Tesla app.

 

[emoore]

I have a Mach-E in the Tesla app and it shows a local NACS location. The Tesla app lets you add multiple vehicles and when I add my Rivian to the Tesla app (with my Mach-E or by itself), the local NACS location disappears from the Find a Charger list, seems like a Tesla app but to me.

Also the NACS site details on the Tesla app still only shows Ford so I think we need to be patient and wait for everything to fall in place. Of course at a MagicDock site all EVs can charge, no matter what you enter in the Tesla app.

Yep same here. So I added a Ford EV even though I don't have one. Once Rivian is approved for supercharger access I will delete the Ford and add my R1T.

 

[sub]

Why? Rivian is sending you one for free?

If I didn't have any trips planned for the next 6 months, I would just wait for the free adapter, but I have several trips planned for this summer that just aren't possible without supercharger access.

Even if some people get their free adapter in April, most people won't. There is no way that Rivian has 100,000 adapters sitting on the shelf ready to go out the door when Ford who should have higher priority than we do is telling people at the bottom of the line not to expect their adapters until the fall.

And if by some miracle I end up at the front of the line and I get my free adapter this spring, I doubt it will be hard to unload the A2Z adapter. I figure that worst case I sell it for $100 but even if I just end up tossing the A2Z adapter in the trash this fall it will have been worth it to not risk being stuck at home all Summer.

 

[ndmiller]

If I didn't have any trips planned for the next 6 months, I would just wait for the free adapter, but I have several trips planned for this summer that just aren't possible without supercharger access.

Even if some people get their free adapter in April, most people won't. There is no way that Rivian has 100,000 adapters sitting on the shelf ready to go out the door when Ford who should have higher priority than we do is telling people at the bottom of the line not to expect their adapters until the fall.

And if by some miracle I end up at the front of the line and I get my free adapter this spring, I doubt it will be hard to unload the A2Z adapter. I figure that worst case I sell it for $100 but even if I just end up tossing the A2Z adapter in the trash this fall it will have been worth it to not risk being stuck at home all Summer.

I hear you, but #1 roadtrips are fine without Tesla Superchargers, and #2 no-one knows if that adapter will even work, it's all just speculation.

 

[R.I.P.]

"roadtrips are fine without Tesla Superchargers "

This is a generalization & untrue.

 

[Dark-Fx]

Why 3/21 specifically?

My vote is for the 19th. First day of spring. "As early as spring 2024"

 

[Killer95Stang]

My vote is for the 19th. First day of spring. "As early as spring 2024"

My guess is the 18th...

 

[emoore]

I hear you, but #1 roadtrips are fine without Tesla Superchargers, and #2 no-one knows if that adapter will even work, it's all just speculation.

#1 not all road trips are possible in a reasonable amount of time. #2 the A2Z adapters work fine with ford. No reason to think it won’t work with Rivian.

 

[sub]

I hear you, but #1 roadtrips are fine without Tesla Superchargers, and #2 no-one knows if that adapter will even work, it's all just speculation.

I am sure that is true in for many, but it is something that varies a lot depending on where you live and where you want to go.

The campground we like to go to is a bit over 300 miles away and there are 0 non-tesla fast chargers between here and there. And there is no electricity at the campground so we would have to squeeze over 600 miles out of the battery (plus a week of vampire drain) if we can't use Tesla chargers. There are 5 Tesla locations along the route.

I tried to go to a closer campground last summer that was only 130 miles away and I didn't make it. I ended up having to make a 4 hour charging stop at a slow charger to get back home because there was no non-tesla fast chargers between my house and the campground.

I am also planning to take my 6000lb boat to the ocean that is over 1000 miles away. There are several segments where we would need to traverse a 200 mile charger gap which I am not confident is feasible while pulling the boat.

So no, my summer plans really aren't possible without access to Tesla's chargers.

It is true that the 3rd party adapter might not work, but early reports are favorable. I think that Rivian not delivering on time is far more likely than the 3rd party adapter not working. And even if the odds are equal, $200 is a reasonable price to pay to cut the risk in half.

 

[Ralph]

*If* Rivian’s agreement with Tesla is to purchase adapters from Tesla, and Tesla cannot or does not deliver in sufficient quantities, should Rivian be held responsible for not meeting their “as early as” date?

 

[ndmiller]

This is a generalization & untrue.

Nonsense, people take roadtrips in EV's not being Teslas all the time.

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